Protests and police on campus

[Langue_doc]

It isn't clear if the majority of the students at Columbia or their parents who are paying their tuition support the protests. Parents who aren't very affluent probably spent years saving up for their children's education, only to find that courses have been moved online, and there's minimal learning. The faculty, according to one of the professors have been asked to modify final exams:

After students occupied the university's storied Hamilton Hall — and police officers in riot gear conducted over 100 arrests — the administration closed the campus, moved all classes online and recommended that we professors either trim or eliminate final examinations in our classes.

Outsiders seem to have taken it upon themselves to join the protests, despite the campus, a private institution, having closed the campus to facutly, students, and other employees. There are bound to be complaints from parents as well as requests that Columbia return this semester's tuition.

The only accomplishments of these protests so far have been the disruption of the costly education of their fellow students and vandalism. The war continues unabated. Protesting in front of the NY state senator's office, the Israeli embassy, and the United Nations would have been far more effective.

[Wahoo Redux]

For my part, I would be curious to know how many especially among those most vocally dismissive or sneering of these protests--have ever participated in a protest of heir own. Because I see a lot of tarring with broad brushes going on.

Dude, I grew up on the west coast in the '80s. 

I observed my fair share of protests and participated in several.  That's part of the reason I think this style of protest has turned sour.

Nevertheless, I marched against the first Gulf War because at the time it seemed like a very scary prospect.  It did not (yet) lead to World War III, but I think we've seen a whole series of atrocities on all sides in part because of it (no facile answers to what we should have done exist, BTW).

So yeah, I've seen protests. 

And for the record, I think one can be anti-occupation and anti-occupied Palestine without being antisemitic.  Israel has things to answer for and America should stop supporting her until she becomes a humane state.  Oh, and Hamas is a terrorist organization.

However, we have been marching, screaming, occupying, and fighting police for close to a hundred years if you count the Bonus Army of 1932.  MLK prevailed because of his maturity in the face of oppression.  Now we have kids occupying their very vulnerable college campuses, resisting when given lawful commands by the police, and then crying to the media when they are arrested.  And many people have a specific kneejerk reaction, "The students were peaceful," as if that gives them the right to break the law.

We need a new cultural imagination to meet our challenges.  I don't think the old system is working any more.

FWIW, I didn't have you in mind.

Fair enough. 

I will concede that these protests have gotten a hella bunch of news.  I doubt that either Israel or Hamas care, but it certainly got the attention of the politicians.

[Wahoo Redux]

And for the record, I think one can be anti-occupation and anti-occupied Palestine without being antisemitic.  Israel has things to answer for and America should stop supporting her until she becomes a humane state.  Oh, and Hamas is a terrorist organization.

However, we have been marching, screaming, occupying, and fighting police for close to a hundred years if you count the Bonus Army of 1932.  MLK prevailed because of his maturity in the face of oppression.  Now we have kids occupying their very vulnerable college campuses, resisting when given lawful commands by the police, and then crying to the media when they are arrested.  And many people have a specific kneejerk reaction, "The students were peaceful," as if that gives them the right to break the law.

We need a new cultural imagination to meet our challenges.  I don't think the old system is working any more.

Well said. What I think many young people don't get is that MLK modelled his actions on Gandhi, and both of them saw that their protests were only a pointer to the social change that would inevitably happen in a basically moral society. No protest had to achieve specific, short term results. The impatience of protests now requires that they have concrete, immediate outcomes, so the disruption has to escalate until they win.

"Getting out the message" has been replaced by "getting in peoples' faces until they cave."

Well, to be fair, MLK and Gandhi led disruptive movements.  I mean, the point of protest is to make people uncomfortable and to make the news.  But they were also involved in a lifelong fight against institutionalized oppression and for their own and their peoples' civil rights, and they both paid the ultimate price.  I've never thought it right to point to the "entitled" or "rich" kids as if it's their fault that their parents are wealthy or to talk about "elite" students as if it is an accusation to be accomplished enough to get into an Ivy, or any college, for that matter.  But we also have to acknowledge that the price the students are paying is pretty cheap, even if they are arrested, and their chants such as "This is what democracy looks like" are cliche, a little facile, and not the ostensible point of their protest. No matter what happens in Palestine or their college campuses, these kids are going to be fine. Then I would be careful about martyring students or professors.  It is bad optics to see cops in riot gear----they look like your typical bad guys in video games or sci fi films----but the police don't want to get hurt, and who can blame them?  I'd armor-up too.  Then I read stories from professors who have no sympathy for a late paper or a missed exam but who are then outraged by police officers upholding the law, hypothetically speaking, of course.  And being a kindly professor is not a get-out-of-jail-free card.

I just don't see the analogous situation between the great era of protest in the '50s through '70s that garnered so many ethical changes in our society and the situations now.  I think we have copycat kids who, while I agree with their stance, are enacting a paradigm that is rather self-serving.   

[spork]

[. . .]

enacting a paradigm that is rather self-serving.   

in the way described by the X tweet I posted upthread.

[Wahoo Redux]

[. . .]

enacting a paradigm that is rather self-serving.   

in the way described by the X tweet I posted upthread.

Yeah, she was brutal. 

[jimbogumbo]

Whether the concept of protest works or not is not my main focus, rather the institutional response. The Big 10 campuses were all really benign protests, but the responses were dramatically different. For example, at Purdue the official response is that if they stay on the Memorial Union Lawn (they have) we'll do nothing. IU and Ohio State both for some ridiculous reason used force (and yes both featured rooftop snipers). Michigan left them alone, while Wisconsin tore down the tents (and yes, they came back anyway).


IU's faculty have called for the President to resign, but recall she canceled several previously scheduled Palestine speakers/artists for no apparent reason but currying favor with politicians. Here is a letter to the editor in the Indy Star:

https://www.indystar.com/story/opinion/readers/2024/05/03/jeffrey-c-isaac-jim-banks-iu-lies-threaten-academic-freedom/73548988007/