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Started by bacardiandlime, January 30, 2020, 03:20:28 PM

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apl68

Quote from: writingprof on June 04, 2020, 12:19:00 PM
I am arguing against the idea that "needing a building and other people" is a sign of weak faith. That's simple not true.

Yes, accusing people who are antsy to resume worship services of having "weak faith" is too harsh.  Those services are very important to a lot of people for a lot of different reasons. 

My impression is that the great majority of churches (certainly in our community and state, and I suspect elsewhere) have recognized the need for some disruption of their usual practices due to quarantine.  Now that we're months into the disruption, they're having to make tough decisions about whether, when, and how to reopen.  Whatever decisions they make, they have in most cases put a good deal of thought into them. 

Part of showing grace is not always assuming the worst motivations of those who make decisions different from the ones we ourselves would have made in the same situation.
All we like sheep have gone astray
We have each turned to his own way
And the Lord has laid upon him the guilt of us all

writingprof

The only differences between gathering for a church service and gathering for a protest are that

1) the Left thinks that the protests are valid and that church is invalid, and
2) politicians are afraid of the mob but are not afraid of churchgoers.

Unless one is ready to condemn protesters for their failure to social-distance, one's condemnation of churchgoers is rank hypocrisy and anti-religious bigotry.

secundem_artem

Quote from: writingprof on June 05, 2020, 09:58:31 AM
The only differences between gathering for a church service and gathering for a protest are that

1) the Left thinks that the protests are valid and that church is invalid, and
2) politicians are afraid of the mob but are not afraid of churchgoers.

Unless one is ready to condemn protesters for their failure to social-distance, one's condemnation of churchgoers is rank hypocrisy and anti-religious bigotry.

Can't say as I agree with that.  That cohort is a large part of the Republican Party's base.  Currying favor with them is a large component of Trump's re-election strategy.  The little photo op this week apparently went over well with the more vocal churchgoing among us.

That said, their demand to hold services and ignore basic public health requirements appear to be as much based in politics as such faith principles they may espouse.

I'm just another failed Catholic.  But to the extent the Vatican says much I'm interested in, the Pope's expectation that people come back to Mass when it's safe, is both sane and respects people's wish for participating in a faith community.  A Muslim friend of mine travels extensively internationally.  She is deeply religious, wears hijab, eats halal, and prays five times a day as Islam expects.  She once to told me that Islam may expect prayer five times a day, but if circumstances make that unreasonable (e.g. being at 38,000 feet), it is acceptable not to pray at that time.

Religion and politics have long seemed to be inextricably intertwined. 
Funeral by funeral, the academy advances

mamselle

Quote from: Hegemony on June 04, 2020, 08:24:30 PM
Mamselle, what date (by which I mean what century) were the mills funded in this way? I have a professional reason for asking.

My work covered a study that ran from about the 12th c. to about the 14th. The actual time period may be longer on either side: those 2 centuries are just the period for which archives documents have been found in that place.

I can PM you with more details...

M.
Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

Reprove not a scorner, lest they hate thee: rebuke the wise, and they will love thee.

Give instruction to the wise, and they will be yet wiser: teach the just, and they will increase in learning.

spork

It's terrible writing, used to obfuscate the fact that the authors actually have nothing to say.

mamselle

Whoa.

Ties to fibro-myalgia-like issues are a serious worry.

Those can be lifelong.

M.
Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

Reprove not a scorner, lest they hate thee: rebuke the wise, and they will love thee.

Give instruction to the wise, and they will be yet wiser: teach the just, and they will increase in learning.

nebo113

Quote from: writingprof on June 05, 2020, 09:58:31 AM
The only differences between gathering for a church service and gathering for a protest are that

1) the Left thinks that the protests are valid and that church is invalid, and
2) politicians are afraid of the mob but are not afraid of churchgoers.

Unless one is ready to condemn protesters for their failure to social-distance, one's condemnation of churchgoers is rank hypocrisy and anti-religious bigotry.

Did you notice that Trump held the Bible upside down and/or backwards? 

Caracal

Quote from: spork on June 06, 2020, 09:30:12 AM
What is probably a chronic immune system response to Covid-19 infection:

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/06/covid-19-coronavirus-longterm-symptoms-months/612679/.

I feel like this is the kind of stuff that calls for both actual studies and concern, but also a healthy amount of skepticism, not towards individuals, but about the larger population effects. A lot of people in the United States have gotten Covid. It doesn't seem particularly surprising that some relatively small number of them have had lingering symptoms. I've had symptoms linger for months from run of the mill colds and I'm a youngish, basically healthy person. (Actually, this happened to me a lot more when I was in my 20s and I now think I might have had some version of air pollution induced asmtha or something which improved pretty dramatically when I moved). People get bad colds all the time and it ends up leading to pneumonia, so it isn't surprising that this severe disease can linger in various ways. However, this doesn't mean there is really any reason to think that this is going to be a major population wide problem down the road. I suspect when you can do actual studies, you'll find that these sorts of long term symptoms are fairly uncommon .

writingprof

Quote from: nebo113 on June 07, 2020, 06:11:12 AM
Quote from: writingprof on June 05, 2020, 09:58:31 AM
The only differences between gathering for a church service and gathering for a protest are that

1) the Left thinks that the protests are valid and that church is invalid, and
2) politicians are afraid of the mob but are not afraid of churchgoers.

Unless one is ready to condemn protesters for their failure to social-distance, one's condemnation of churchgoers is rank hypocrisy and anti-religious bigotry.

Did you notice that Trump held the Bible upside down and/or backwards?

What does that have to do with anything?  I don't like the President and didn't vote for him.  One's feelings about Trump are immaterial to the argument I'm making.

nebo113

Quote from: writingprof on June 07, 2020, 08:56:37 AM
Quote from: nebo113 on June 07, 2020, 06:11:12 AM
Quote from: writingprof on June 05, 2020, 09:58:31 AM
The only differences between gathering for a church service and gathering for a protest are that

1) the Left thinks that the protests are valid and that church is invalid, and
2) politicians are afraid of the mob but are not afraid of churchgoers.

Unless one is ready to condemn protesters for their failure to social-distance, one's condemnation of churchgoers is rank hypocrisy and anti-religious bigotry.

Did you notice that Trump held the Bible upside down and/or backwards?

What does that have to do with anything?  I don't like the President and didn't vote for him.  One's feelings about Trump are immaterial to the argument I'm making.

It's a simple question.

Cheerful

New Zealand, with all of its special qualities, is "coronavirus-free" for now.  They hope to contain new cases.

"...no positive cases reported in the past 17 days. There has been no one receiving treatment in hospital for Covid-19 for the past 12 days and it has been 40 days since the last case of community transmission."  -- CNN

Congrats to New Zealand!


apl68

Had an appalling incident at work earlier today.  A patron deliberately leaned around the sneeze guards at the circulation desk and breathed in a staff member's face.  Two staff members witnessed it.  I'm getting in touch with authorities to determine what kind of response to make.  At minimum a serious reprimand.  He may be looking at being banned.
All we like sheep have gone astray
We have each turned to his own way
And the Lord has laid upon him the guilt of us all

Caracal

Quote from: apl68 on June 11, 2020, 01:19:56 PM
Had an appalling incident at work earlier today.  A patron deliberately leaned around the sneeze guards at the circulation desk and breathed in a staff member's face.  Two staff members witnessed it.  I'm getting in touch with authorities to determine what kind of response to make.  At minimum a serious reprimand.  He may be looking at being banned.

Ugh. Was he trying to breathe in his face, or was he just totally oblivious?

clean

On my campus we have a formal "incident report form" and that can trigger an investigation and could lead to probation, suspension, expulsion, or (worse) 'reeducation' where they may be required to write a paper on the dangers of what they did wrong.  (They try to push the 'reform' rather than the 'punish' side of things. )  BUT I Would certainly file such a form in this case!!
"The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am"  Darth Vader

apl68

Quote from: Caracal on June 11, 2020, 01:55:01 PM
Quote from: apl68 on June 11, 2020, 01:19:56 PM
Had an appalling incident at work earlier today.  A patron deliberately leaned around the sneeze guards at the circulation desk and breathed in a staff member's face.  Two staff members witnessed it.  I'm getting in touch with authorities to determine what kind of response to make.  At minimum a serious reprimand.  He may be looking at being banned.

Ugh. Was he trying to breathe in his face, or was he just totally oblivious?

According to both witnesses, it was quite deliberate.  When he did so, he was heard by both saying (of the sneeze guard) "That didn't stop it, did it?"
All we like sheep have gone astray
We have each turned to his own way
And the Lord has laid upon him the guilt of us all