Some academics have no desire or intention to retire. Others would like to retire many years before age 62, if possible.
At what age would you like to retire?
At what age do you plan to retire?
I'm kinda sorta planning on 65, but I know perfectly well that my actual decision will be influenced much more by my health/spouse's health than by any specific goal on my part. I continue to squirrel away nuts for the future, in any event.
Given my current pension plan, somewhere between 65-71.
As far as desire is concerned, however, I'd say the sooner the better.
Since I don't have to pull from my TIAA until 72, it would be beneficial to be employed until then.
However, I'd rather it be closer to 65 if I have the money. I'm 55, so, likely not earlier than a decade from now, possibly longer, but not by a lot. I don't plan to work until death.
Right now it's pretty easy to retire to Spain or Portugal. It's tempting to rent out my place, take early retirement, move, become an alcoholic on good cheap wine...
Unless something drastically improves (financially) or declines (medically), I don't see how I can afford to retire before 70. 75 is probably more reasonable, seeing the youngest through college. I am ok with that.
My spouse would like to retire much earlier -- 55 or thereabouts -- but I don't think that's going to work, unless "retirement" really means "change jobs".
When I was 30, I planned to retire at 60. This might have worked had Mr. Eagle not become disabled in his mid-50s, and mine was the only income, so I extended that to FRA, 66+. Then I lost my job, just before turning 63, so it looks like 63 is it. Holding off on SS as long as I can.
Ouch.
All good thoughts.
M.
I retired at 57, mostly due to a new university president who was ethically challenged while I was definitely in the position where malodorous consequences would flow. My SO was forced out a year later. We have much less money that we planned, but the end of the firehose of toxicity has been worth it. We try to live on less so that we can enjoy each day more. I'm 65 now, and have never regretted retiring.
QuoteSince I don't have to pull from my TIAA until 72, it would be beneficial to be employed until then.
However, I'd rather it be closer to 65 if I have the money. I'm 55, so, likely not earlier than a decade from now, possibly longer, but not by a lot. I don't plan to work until death.
Ruralguy...
I am not sure of your situation. The rules for withdrawals from a 401k/403b are somewhat complex. IF you have a TIAA account at your current employer (not a former employer) and you continue to work past 72, you are not required to make the Required Minimum Distributions from that account. You would have to take the RMD from IRA accounts and accounts from prior employers.
QuoteAt what age would you like to retire?
At what age do you plan to retire?
I hope to be ABLE to retire at 60. I should have sufficient savings at that point, barring a 'market correction'/collapse, I should be ok to retire then. (Unless I just jinxed it here!!)
My retirement date is currently Dec 2024. I qualify for health insurance in May 2024, but I plan to take that summer off on a big 3 month vacation in Alaska... which would be expensive... SO I plan to return to work for the next term to help cover that cost! (and make everyone look at my pictures!!!)
A few months ago, I was contemplating working one more term after, to May 2025. That would replace one of my low, low social security earnings years. The result would be an additional 1/2 a year's salary, plus given my calculations, increase my social security payment by $20 a month, for life. (Though I would not begin collecting social security for almost 7 more years at the earliest... so It is a small order of small in the scheme of things and am not likely to work an extra semester only for Social Security payments of an extra $20 that dont start for over 6 years (or maybe even 10!!).
The other events that are encouraging me to leaver earlier are somewhat complex. I had a health episode in October. I am still working through the tests, but it is probably resolved now. However, my aunt, about 13 years older than I at 67 now, was just diagnosed with inoperable stage 3 cancer. In addition, my parents are in their low/mid 70s, but they retired around 60 and did A LOT of things. I now see what 70s are looking like. I just dont see that I can accomplish anywhere near what my parents did in their 60s IF I wait into my 70s. I have some things that I would like to accomplish and more and more I realize that the future is far from guaranteed and that health can be fleeting. IF you have goals, you postpone them at your peril.
My former department chair abruptly retired a few years ago. It was shortly after his mother had died (at an advanced age). When I asked him about the decision, he said a few things of note. 1. Once you have enough money, what are you working for (how do you want to spend your life)? 2. Dont retire From something, retire TO something.
So this is a long, long answer to say that I hope to be ABLE to retire by 59 1/2 and be WILLING to retire by 60 1/4 (more or less) IF not at 59 1/2!
Quote from: Cheerful on January 17, 2020, 12:59:05 PM
At what age do you plan to retire?
71 on the high end, 68 on the low end.
I qualified with others for a buy out at my university. We were informed that if we did not take the buy out there was no guarantee we would retain our jobs. I was 65 and took it. So did many more faculty and staff than they expected.
I was diagnosed with a pulmonary disease a few months later and now spend my days exercising, volunteering, taking classes, playing with my grandchildren and visiting two family members in nursing homes. I would like to thank my bullish former boss for making my decision easier.
Thanks, Clean, for setting me straight on RMD's. Honestly, I was just using that as an excuse for not retiring too late, but I guess now I just have to set that limit myself. Ideally, before 70, but probably not before 65. My daughter will graduate college when I am 68, so perhaps that's ideal. My wife is 9 years younger, in good health, and has income other than her professorship. She could retire at the same time if she wants to.
Plan to retire at 65 or 66. 63 now - I started downshifting this year working 80% and giving up some non-essential tasks. Not sure if I will stay at 80 or shift down again next year. I
Quote from: Cheerful on January 17, 2020, 12:59:05 PM
Some academics have no desire or intention to retire. Others would like to retire many years before age 62, if possible.
At what age would you like to retire?
At what age do you plan to retire?
I wanted to be rich and retired by age 30 but things worked out differently for me.
I have no idea about any specific age. It all depends on the economy and how it affects the stock market and inflation. I would like to string together several part time gigs and ease into retirement by age 60.
I retired at 65 as I had no choice in the country I was in. Since then I just haven't felt like working and I'm doing OK financially so I don't need to work.
Too many unkowns to have a real answer to either question. Right now I'm saving, with no specific plan as to whether it's for a rainy day or for retirement specifically. I don't want to work until I die, but when I want to retire will depend on two things:
-My health
-How badly and how fast academia deteriorates. That it will continue deteriorating as a career is a given (glut of PhDs and other higher degrees) the only question is how fast and how bad.
When I will in fact retire will depend on my health and my finances.
Turning 60 soon... (in the next 90 days!)
I might be able to retire now, but it would be with a lean retirement budget.
So I'm thinking a couple more years.
QuoteWhen I will in fact retire will depend on my health and my finances.
If we add 'health care/insurance' to this, then I think that we would have 95% of the basis for the decision to retire.
My best friend died before retiring (at 69 or 70). He kept working because he and his wife lived only a block away from his inlaws. His wife was heavily involved in their care or supervision. He said that he wanted to travel in retirement, but that his wife would not be able (willing) to leave town for very long. Since he couldnt travel, why quit?
Also, as he was in the defined benefit (rather than the traditional pension) plan, he reasoned that the longer he worked, the more that was added to his retirement accounts instead of coming out of his accounts.
In sum, if we combine wealth (retirement income), health (ability to work), health care and the presence or level of family commitments I suspect that we have the vast majority of factors that determine one's retirement timing decision. I imagine 'hassle factor' or enjoyment of the job and having something to 'retire to' (echoing my retired chair's advice 'dont retire FROM something, retire TO something). What other factors do you think would influence the decision?
60 or soon after that. My spouse and I are saving aggressively and forgoing homeownership, but both of those moves mean we might be *able* to retire earlier than that. But to retire well? 60 or so.
I could have retired 4 years ago with insurance and other perks. We've also accumulated enough passive income vehicles to sustain us through our retirements. However, the antisons are still in school/at home, and Mr. Anti plans to die in his office. Quite honestly, my job is pretty enjoyable. If I had a financially viable plan B, retirement from this position might be tempting. I can't really justify walking away from a stable position while we have dependent children at home. Rattling around at home by myself doesn't appeal at this point. So, to work I go.
I'm in my early 50s and have yet to even really think about it. Among us Gen-Xers the conventional wisdom has always been that previous generations will have bankrupted Social Security by the time we reached age 65. I'm a participant in a state pension fund that's in much better shape than some, but who knows how things will work out over the next 20 years. It will presumably be another 18-20 years until retirement, assuming it's ever a possibility.
My main concern is that the public library I direct will be able to stay open that long. Our local economy suffered a severe blow with a major mill closure in recent months. This will likely have the effect of fast-forwarding the area's long-term economic decline. In a worst-case scenario I can see us being down to a skeleton staff by 2035, with me having had to take a pay cut in the meantime (Barring some near-miraculous turnaround I don't intend ever to ask for another raise). In a very worst-case scenario we could be closed before then.
Only God knows what the future holds. Nothing to do but do our best and trust in him in the meantime.
I daydream about what the kids are calling FIRE- Financial Independence, Early Retirement.
Basically you just need to have lots of privileges and advantages growing up, no debt, get a 100k tech jobs, but still live like you're in college on $20k. Then you can retire in your 30's and live off of your interest.
I did the math and that'll ever happen for me.
One advantage of this general line of work is that it's not as physically demanding as, say, mining coal. I don't know when, or even if, I'll retire. My wife has a chronic condition that would absolutely bankrupt us on private insurance, so as long as my university's health insurance covers her treatment, I have a big incentive to stay. And as long as the job has a lot of flexibility, why not stay?
When I got my Ph.D., there was still a guy in our department who was nominally full-time (though I don't think he taught, just did research) in his mid-to-late 80s.
Quote from: Cheerful on January 17, 2020, 12:59:05 PM
Some academics have no desire or intention to retire. Others would like to retire many years before age 62, if possible.
At what age would you like to retire?
At what age do you plan to retire?
I expect to work as long as I can. When I can't work any more, it will be because either (a) I'm not getting hired or (b) I don't have the good health and stamina.
I'm already beginning to see the effects of (a) in the form of age discrimination. Colleges cannot age discriminate legally, but they can certainly do it legally through the students. And they do. When the the students have some flexibility in choosing their instructor, and greater age is not an attraction, you lose hours. You can try to get your union to go to bat for you on seniority if you want to go that route.
(b) is not a problem. I didn't miss any teaching in the fall semester. No calling in sick, nothing like that. I think I teach better than I ever did. But I guess that's just a theory.
Just saw this:
Quote from: pgher on January 20, 2020, 04:46:53 PM
One advantage of this general line of work is that it's not as physically demanding as, say, mining coal. I don't know when, or even if, I'll retire. My wife has a chronic condition that would absolutely bankrupt us on private insurance, so as long as my university's health insurance covers her treatment, I have a big incentive to stay. And as long as the job has a lot of flexibility, why not stay?
When I got my Ph.D., there was still a guy in our department who was nominally full-time (though I don't think he taught, just did research) in his mid-to-late 80s.
Sure, many academics would retire and then catch up on their reading and study. So that may be not that different from teaching as long as your students aren't giving you a hassle and you are able to get to work. 'Life is short, but art is long.'
Quote from: pgher on January 20, 2020, 04:46:53 PM
One advantage of this general line of work is that it's not as physically demanding as, say, mining coal. I don't know when, or even if, I'll retire. My wife has a chronic condition that would absolutely bankrupt us on private insurance, so as long as my university's health insurance covers her treatment, I have a big incentive to stay. And as long as the job has a lot of flexibility, why not stay?
When I got my Ph.D., there was still a guy in our department who was nominally full-time (though I don't think he taught, just did research) in his mid-to-late 80s.
Mid-80s -- Whippersnapper! I have at least two colleagues in their mid-90s, with no signs of leaving.
Quote from: dr_codex on January 20, 2020, 04:54:13 PM
Quote from: pgher on January 20, 2020, 04:46:53 PM
One advantage of this general line of work is that it's not as physically demanding as, say, mining coal. I don't know when, or even if, I'll retire. My wife has a chronic condition that would absolutely bankrupt us on private insurance, so as long as my university's health insurance covers her treatment, I have a big incentive to stay. And as long as the job has a lot of flexibility, why not stay?
When I got my Ph.D., there was still a guy in our department who was nominally full-time (though I don't think he taught, just did research) in his mid-to-late 80s.
Mid-80s -- Whippersnapper! I have at least two colleagues in their mid-90s, with no signs of leaving.
Or maybe they need the money.
Some weeks, I look forward to retiring at 62. Other weeks, I hope to continue working forever. Lately, I've been thinking that retiring at 62 and looking for a part-time job running a cash register at Target or WalMart might be ideal. Enough work to give a bit of structure to my day, but very little responsibility sounds good.
I've been planning to be able to retire at 62, in 2025. I'm on track to retire with 90% of my gross monthly salary from two of the better-funded state pension plans and social security. I'm focusing on my deferred compensation account currently. I want at least $200k in it, so I can buy into a continuing care retirement community around age 70.
What I've been working towards is to be able to retire at 62 and live moderately comfortably. So far I'm on track for that, or so says TIAA and the other calculators I've used to keep me on track. Now, whether I choose to retire at 62 or not remains to be seen.
Monday* or never.
And since I have nothing in place for Monday...well....
M.
*Not totally facetious...a significant birthday approacheth....
Quite a few people I know in their late 50s without kids are now either retired, semi-retired, or close to retiring. Even some with kids are thinking about it. I'm sort of semi-retired although I guess with my work load this semester, not really.
I'd probably want to keep teaching for a long time if only to keep access to a university library. But I could do a couple of online courses each semester and that would be enough.
Age 70 for me is the target. My social security retirement age is 67 in any case, and I didn't start contributing to TIAA-CREF until I was 34. But if I am still productive and having fun I'll keep at it a while longer. It's indoor work with little heavy lifting.
Thanks to posters so far! I have benefited from reading your different experiences and perspectives. Hope this thread continues. I'm interested in reading more.
Quote from: clean on January 17, 2020, 06:19:39 PM
I now see what 70s are looking like. I just dont see that I can accomplish anywhere near what my parents did in their 60s IF I wait into my 70s. I have some things that I would like to accomplish and more and more I realize that the future is far from guaranteed and that health can be fleeting. IF you have goals, you postpone them at your peril.
Glad you're doing better, clean! I agree with what you say about the 70s and want to retire long before age 70. Ideally, I would like to have the option of retiring as soon as possible and then make my decision rather than having it made for me. The federal retirement age shouldn't be raised just because people are living longer. Quality of life matters.
Quote from: clean on January 19, 2020, 10:27:25 AM
In sum, if we combine wealth (retirement income), health (ability to work), health care and the presence or level of family commitments I suspect that we have the vast majority of factors that determine one's retirement timing decision. I imagine 'hassle factor' or enjoyment of the job and having something to 'retire to' (echoing my retired chair's advice 'dont retire FROM something, retire TO something). What other factors do you think would influence the decision?
This list covers many factors, thanks.
Quote from: Stockmann on January 19, 2020, 08:13:21 AM
[. . .]
when I want to retire will depend on two things:
-My health
-How badly and how fast academia deteriorates. That it will continue deteriorating as a career is a given (glut of PhDs and other higher degrees) the only question is how fast and how bad.
When I will in fact retire will depend on my health and my finances.
My thinking up until a few years ago was that I would continue working until 70 or 72, with my wife, four years younger, retiring at about the same time. Now I'm at 53, regaining my health after almost two years of idiot physicians not identifying the cause of the problem, and work has steadily become less satisfying. Job conditions are probably going to deteriorate over the long term as the pool of potential students shrinks. So 65 is looking more realistic.
My wife and I have stepped up our efforts to do now what we say we will do during retirement -- such as travel internationally -- while we are still physically able to do it. Recently we have checked Istanbul, Morocco, and Belize off our list.
I'm 63 and according to Sociable Insecurity, my retirement age is 66 yrs 4 months. Assuming no major health crisis, my planned retirement age is 70. For a number of reasons, Mrs. Artem and I were not in a position to save much towards retirement until we were in our 40's. My TIAA account has done VERY well the last few years, but Mrs. A's employer's pension contributions were in the form of shares in their failing industry. And then she got downsized out of a job. So my decision to hang on until 70 looks like a firm one, barring any unforeseen disasters.
More recently, Artem U has begun making increasingly unsubtle noises about convincing some of us alte kakers to consider early retirement. Our Bored of Trustees has just approved a buyout package worth approximately 2 packs of gum and a bag of chips.
Retirement at age 70 it is. At which point we will move back to our home country where the exchange rate and health care system should be more conducive to not living on cat food.
All this of course, assumes that Agent Orange does not collapse the entire global economy with another of his idiotic tweets.
I'm still fairly young, so who knows what will change by then but I don't really envision retiring until I have to for health reasons. I like working, but again that could change by he time I reach that decision. The earliest I can see would be 65 though, based on pension etc.
Quote from: Cheerful on January 17, 2020, 12:59:05 PM
Some academics have no desire or intention to retire. Others would like to retire many years before age 62, if possible.
At what age would you like to retire?
At what age do you plan to retire?
I'd like to retire at 60, if not sooner, which is still 20 years away. However, I don't know what future health conditions might afflict myself or partner, so would be willing to work until 65 or 70, as necessary. My mom passed from cancer in her mid-60's, as did a colleague in his mid-50's, so I plan to retire as soon as possible and buy that RV we've been dreaming about and travel the U.S.
I'm in my mid fifties and have changed jobs and countries a few times. I'm currently in a new leadership role which I really enjoy and I'd like to be in higher level positions before I retire. So right now, for financial planning reasons, I'm saying 72 which would give me just over 15 more years of working. Of course, health or other circumstances could change this.
I'm 64 now and retired at 62. I am completely happy I did; the point was to retire while I still had good energy to enjoy it, work on nonacademic writing projects, dabble in art, travel, etc.
With the extra time and available energy, I've had good success in publishing those projects. I've had some amazing trips that were fantastic partly because I'm still young enough to clamber around in challenging environments, and although I hope to stay clamberworthy well into my 70's or beyond, realistically this is my good decade for all that.
I'm living pretty frugally and can get by leaning partly on SO's income, though if I were on my own I'd increase my freelance editing work to generate the needed additional income. I don't think I would have kept working my academic job even in that situation—it was time to close that career out.
I wish someone would decide this for me. Like in Greece, where the government says to academics "You are out at 65 and will never work in academia again".
I can't make up my mind. I love my job so much, but the administration types are more frustrating to me every year (or I have less patience). I wanted to keep working long enough to see my discipline become truly diverse and inclusive, but that is just not happening fast enough. I have no health reason to retire, and the savings are adequate.
The only advice I have is: When you have decided to retire, don't announce it too far in advance. People pretty quickly start talking about you as if you were already a ghost. I've seen this on multiple occasions.
Quote from: Tee_Bee on January 23, 2020, 06:41:41 AM
Age 70 for me is the target. My social security retirement age is 67 in any case, and I didn't start contributing to TIAA-CREF until I was 34. But if I am still productive and having fun I'll keep at it a while longer. It's indoor work with little heavy lifting.
Age 70 has been my target, but I find myself increasingly bored and frustrated with higher education's growing obsession with administrivia, while having less patience with students who don't know what they don't know and don't care about learning. Maybe I'm just in a cranky phase, but at last check, it looked like I could probably retire comfortably at 67, and I'm seriously considering that option. Nothing set in stone, yet.
Quote from: 0susanna on January 30, 2020, 10:23:59 AM
Quote from: Tee_Bee on January 23, 2020, 06:41:41 AM
Age 70 for me is the target. My social security retirement age is 67 in any case, and I didn't start contributing to TIAA-CREF until I was 34. But if I am still productive and having fun I'll keep at it a while longer. It's indoor work with little heavy lifting.
Age 70 has been my target, but I find myself increasingly bored and frustrated with higher education's growing obsession with administrivia, while having less patience with students who don't know what they don't know and don't care about learning. Maybe I'm just in a cranky phase, but at last check, it looked like I could probably retire comfortably at 67, and I'm seriously considering that option. Nothing set in stone, yet.
Update: According to my TIAA rep, I could retire at 67, and spouse at 62, with minimal increases to current contributions. Better than I'd hoped.
Has anyone changed their retirement plans or dreams since January?
We have a staff member who has been making noises about retirement. She's 63 but could pass for older. I've been trying to encourage her to hang in there for another couple of years, so that she doesn't have to take any penalty on her SS or state pension. Her finances are tough enough as it is. Plus, she's a very dependable worker, and would not be easy to replace.
In January, I was unemployed and expected to stay that way, given my age (63 at that time). I lucked out and got a job in June. I took a significant pay cut, but still..... At that time, I hoped to hang on for another three years and make it to FRA.
The job is a major disappointment - mostly due to COVID, I think - and I don't think I'll keep it past this year. I'll make 65 and probably retire this summer. Mr. Eagle's health is not improving and his mobility is decreasing, so if we want to do any traveling, now is the time. I don't think I'll regret it at all.
If I could retire this year, I would. It's been a stressful year and I expect the stress to continue for several years as we deal with economic impact of pandemic. But I'm only 57 and all my retirement planning has been aimed at 62-67, depending on health and continuing to enjoy my work most days. Right now, I'm fairly sure I'll retire May 2025, as soon as I'm eligible for pension.
Thanks for reviving the thread.
It was kind of startling to see my last-year's answer and realize it was what I was just about to write in reply for this year.
Some things haven't changed much, yet.
M.
Whenever my lottery ticket comes in. Or 68...or 70...
I'm already past the lower end of the retirement age some have mentioned here. Money never burned a hole in my pocket. Work, save, work, save.
I don't see it feasibly happening before age 70--around 2038. It's hard to be optimistic about what retirement will be like then.
I genuinely think that, assuming I can work, I will work until I die. We don't spend a lot and we bought a very reasonably priced home so we're better off than many of our peers but we have a lot of medical bills as well.
I will likely work longer than I expected at the beginning of the year. This is not due to Covid but rather due to good news this year when a grant came through that was somewhat unexpected. I have to stay an active employee for us to get the money. But I've received permission to remain active but at low FTE in the last year of the grant (2023).
Quote from: Volhiker78 on November 05, 2020, 08:12:09 AM
I will likely work longer than I expected at the beginning of the year. This is not due to Covid but rather due to good news this year when a grant came through that was somewhat unexpected. I have to stay an active employee for us to get the money. But I've received permission to remain active but at low FTE in the last year of the grant (2023).
Does your school have an emeritus/retained grant PI option? If so, that might be worth looking into.
Someone I worked for was able to complete their "life's work" book under that structure, and saw three more doctoral students through their degrees as well.
M.
M.
Quote from: mamselle on November 05, 2020, 08:16:50 AM
Does your school have an emeritus/retained grant PI option? If so, that might be worth looking into.
Someone I worked for was able to complete their "life's work" book under that structure, and saw three more doctoral students through their degrees as well.
M.
M.
I asked my director and he said no, emeritus/adjunct faculty are not allowed to get funding. Since I am a 100% research track position, its not really an issue because my director said he is allowed to keep me 'active' at whatever small %effort I wanted. So, its possible that in 2023, I'll be down to 15-25% effort overall.
Ah.
Too bad, the school's impetus would be to retain their claims on overhead from grants, which is what impelled the structure I mentioned above at that school.
But at least it's good that there's a way to keep your work grant-active.
M.
Many thanks to everyone who has posted in this thread; I have learnt a lot. I am surprised however by how many people would like to retire so early. I am afraid that I will never want to retire (as long as my health allows me, of course). I am extremely busy, always swamped with work, and always complain about how I never have time, but I always look forward to having more time, such as through sabbaticals or times when I will never need to do admin work any more (and just enjoy teaching and writing). I see that retiring early will not be a problem for me savings wise, but I am truly afraid that I will never want to retire, even if I could comfortably, whether at 65 or 75. I am afraid life after retirement would be boring. Plus, it is nice to be able to travel for free everywhere in the world, for conferences, etc. (though yes, Covid has complicated it recently) In the meanwhile, I also see colleagues around who are in their 90s and not retiring.
Quote from: Pomegranate on November 14, 2021, 11:06:34 AM
I am truly afraid that I will never want to retire, even if I could comfortably, whether at 65 or 75. I am afraid life after retirement would be boring.
You may (or may not) change your mind over time.
Quote from: Pomegranate on November 14, 2021, 11:06:34 AM
In the meanwhile, I also see colleagues around who are in their 90s and not retiring.
What do people here think about that? Are these age 90s colleagues contributing as much as other colleagues? Should there be a mandatory retirement age? If so, why and how old? If not, why not?
Quote from: Cheerful on November 14, 2021, 11:37:42 AM
Quote from: Pomegranate on November 14, 2021, 11:06:34 AM
I am truly afraid that I will never want to retire, even if I could comfortably, whether at 65 or 75. I am afraid life after retirement would be boring.
You may (or may not) change your mind over time.
Quote from: Pomegranate on November 14, 2021, 11:06:34 AM
In the meanwhile, I also see colleagues around who are in their 90s and not retiring.
What do people here think about that? Are these age 90s colleagues contributing as much as other colleagues? Should there be a mandatory retirement age? If so, why and how old? If not, why not?
Good question. There should not be a statutory retirement age, but it should be legal to write one into a contract. Presently it is not legal to agree to one of the usual retirement ages, say, 55 -70 or something.
Me, I thought about retiring for a long time and decided on age 70, and I did retire at that age. There was the [small] fear of losing it in the classroom, but more that in the half wonderful job I had, I always had to go toe to toe with the admin.
Quote
What do people here think about that? Are these age 90s colleagues contributing as much as other colleagues? Should there be a mandatory retirement age? If so, why and how old? If not, why not?
In the Olden Days, tenure included a mandatory retirement age. That went away like 50 years ago (in the 70s I believe). It is an age discrimination issue. So the Why Not question has long since been resolved.
The Federal government has mandatory retirement requirements for some public safety reasons I believe. Airline Pilots face mandatory retirement at 60 I believe. FBI agents at 55 I think, perhaps other federal law enforcement agents.
On the other hand, judges dont face a retirement age.
In private practice, doctors dont either. Depending on the practice/specialty I dont see a reason to require doctors to retire due to age. The balance to that is that malpractice insurance may well have age as a premium factor, and certainly loss experience for sure! In addition, as one ages the doctor/surgeon may reach their ability to actually do the surgery (or as many) because o f the physical demands it may take.
Given that it takes a long time to get the education to be a professor or medical doctor, and that there is no public safety issue in general, I m not sure that there should be a mandatory retirement limit.
Among the checks and balances would be the Defined Benefit Retirement plans (the traditional pension). Once one maxes out on the time function of the benefit, the only way to get more retirement dollars is to increase the salary component. However, eventually, hopefully anyway, one realizes that they are only actually working for a small percentage of the salary and the non salary benefits. Those non salary benefits may be outweighed by the idiocy of admincritters!
For instance, IF one has maxed out the time at say 30 years, and the formula is as low as 2% times years of service times average high year salary....(Sometimes LAST 5 year salary). Under this formula (which is likely on the low side of benefits) the retirement benefit would be 60% of salary. Working only gathers 40% more. The question then becomes, IS putting up with those Admincritters worth the extra 40%?
Also, the 40% is a theoretical cap. Remember that IF you work, you pay for social security taxes on ALL of your wages, while you are working you will be contributing to retirement (even though your benefit will be maxed, or nearly so). Using my own deductions, working would mean that I am paying 7.6% in social security type taxes, 6.6% in retirement, and almost $50 for parking just for the opportunity of NOT retiring. So now you are working for about (40-15)% of salary and that is before paying your marginal income tax on the additional earnings, dropping the value further! Finally, there are the other expenses of work clothes, special cleaning that is required, and the opportunity costs that working creates.
I qualify for health insurance in retirement in 2 1/2 years. My initial retirement target date is in 3 years. I will be 60. I should have enough money. At that point, IF my projections support that I DO have enough, then there will be a high probability that I will end my 'work for pay' career. IF I continue to work, it will be because some other issues prevent me from doing something else (family conditions/situation). However, at this point, I find it hard to imagine that I will be working at 62, much less 65. However, I have been teaching summer school every year for as long as I have worked, and while I am committed to teach this upcoming year, I am not, and NOT teaching summers may change the total work situation as well.
Once I reach 60, assuming that I have reached my financial goals, I expect that my tenure will be Day to Day, not even Semester to Semester, and certainly not Year to Year! At that time I will work under MY terms, not theirs!
Unless I move to better pastures, it's mid-70s at the earliest.
It seems like Americans retire later--perhaps because of medical insurance coverage. I would get my full pension at age 58, but don't think I will stay that long.
When I was young, I thought I would work forever, since I could not see any reason to quit.
Now, I am fully cognizant that in 2027 I will be eligible for retirement benefits (access to health insurance being the prime benefit) at my current university and that same year marks the year in which I will have completed 35 years of SS-eligible pay with at least $1k of income (oh, those years of only working during the summers...). I have sufficient savings that I can retire at any time, but hope to make it at least 6 more years to increase the base level of social security (increasing at about 1.5% per year, as I fill in those years of $0 income) and to have access to the university retirement benefits. I'll have to see how things look at that point - I have witnessed deadwood professors in my department and I don't know if I would be willing to join their cadre just to keep pulling in a paycheck.
But you, being you, will probably keep the parenchymal juices flowing....
M.
I have been adjuncting one course (fall semesters) since I retired at ca. seventy. Health problems ("not single spies, but in battalions") this fall have convinced me that at seventy-seven it was time to say farewell. I had my course taken over and I have graded my very last exams. I gave the class an extra five points on the last exam as a token of thanks for--well, for being the "last."
Poignant....
But keep posting here!
M.
Quote from: Juvenal on November 14, 2021, 05:08:56 PM
I have been adjuncting one course (fall semesters) since I retired at ca. seventy. Health problems ("not single spies, but in battalions") this fall have convinced me that at seventy-seven it was time to say farewell. I had my course taken over and I have graded my very last exams. I gave the class an extra five points on the last exam as a token of thanks for--well, for being the "last."
I feel, I will likely leave in this way, going for it until whenever my health doesn't allow me to. Do you know whether you will continue to live where your university is located? Or do you have plans to move? I know, those who retire by 65 or earlier usually have plans to relocate, but how about those of us who like to stay as long as possible?
Quote from: clean on November 14, 2021, 12:31:14 PMAmong the checks and balances would be the Defined Benefit Retirement plans (the traditional pension). Once one maxes out on the time function of the benefit, the only way to get more retirement dollars is to increase the salary component. However, eventually, hopefully anyway, one realizes that they are only actually working for a small percentage of the salary and the non salary benefits. Those non salary benefits may be outweighed by the idiocy of admincritters!
For instance, IF one has maxed out the time at say 30 years, and the formula is as low as 2% times years of service times average high year salary....(Sometimes LAST 5 year salary). Under this formula (which is likely on the low side of benefits) the retirement benefit would be 60% of salary. Working only gathers 40% more. The question then becomes, IS putting up with those Admincritters worth the extra 40%?
Also, the 40% is a theoretical cap. Remember that IF you work, you pay for social security taxes on ALL of your wages, while you are working you will be contributing to retirement (even though your benefit will be maxed, or nearly so). Using my own deductions, working would mean that I am paying 7.6% in social security type taxes, 6.6% in retirement, and almost $50 for parking just for the opportunity of NOT retiring. So now you are working for about (40-15)% of salary and that is before paying your marginal income tax on the additional earnings, dropping the value further! Finally, there are the other expenses of work clothes, special cleaning that is required, and the opportunity costs that working creates.
That's a good point, I currently contribute 8% to my pension, and social security tax, and I accrue 2.5% per year of service, so I only need to serve 35 years in order to match my take home salary in pension payments, and by that measure I can max out at age 69. It's possible to game the system by accepting a mid level administrative appointment just prior to retirement, which would increase the pensionable income basis from a 9 month academic year appointment to a 12 month calendar appointment.
Quote from: Pomegranate on November 14, 2021, 08:51:44 PM
Quote from: Juvenal on November 14, 2021, 05:08:56 PM
I have been adjuncting one course (fall semesters) since I retired at ca. seventy. Health problems ("not single spies, but in battalions") this fall have convinced me that at seventy-seven it was time to say farewell. I had my course taken over and I have graded my very last exams. I gave the class an extra five points on the last exam as a token of thanks for--well, for being the "last."
I feel, I will likely leave in this way, going for it until whenever my health doesn't allow me to. Do you know whether you will continue to live where your university is located? Or do you have plans to move? I know, those who retire by 65 or earlier usually have plans to relocate, but how about those of us who like to stay as long as possible?
No plans to move. Decades of "stuff," and far too many books, makes the thought of re-locating moot. Anyway, I'm surrounded by physicians (but try to get an appointment). I will surely leave the current "just adequate" home feet first.
Got my Medicare card in the mail today. Hoping to retire at age 70. That said, I want to be gone at least 1 year before somebody says, "Somebody really needs to talk to that guy."
Nearly two years ago I posted 71 on the high end, 68 on the low end. That will not change due to financial considerations, yet the pandemic and the administrative nonsense that takes up much of my time make me wish it could be sooner.
I don't plan to truly retire, but I do plan to end my outside employment. I will remain active in research and creative activities, yet do so on my own schedule. Working from home last year has taught me that I need not fear retirement. I will never be bored.
QuoteQuote from: clean on November 14, 2021, 12:31:14 PM
Among the checks and balances would be the Defined Benefit Retirement plans (the traditional pension). Once one maxes out on the time function of the benefit, the only way to get more retirement dollars is to increase the salary component. However, eventually, hopefully anyway, one realizes that they are only actually working for a small percentage of the salary and the non salary benefits. Those non salary benefits may be outweighed by the idiocy of admincritters!
For instance, IF one has maxed out the time at say 30 years, and the formula is as low as 2% times years of service times average high year salary....(Sometimes LAST 5 year salary). Under this formula (which is likely on the low side of benefits) the retirement benefit would be 60% of salary. Working only gathers 40% more. The question then becomes, IS putting up with those Admincritters worth the extra 40%?
Also, the 40% is a theoretical cap. Remember that IF you work, you pay for social security taxes on ALL of your wages, while you are working you will be contributing to retirement (even though your benefit will be maxed, or nearly so). Using my own deductions, working would mean that I am paying 7.6% in social security type taxes, 6.6% in retirement, and almost $50 for parking just for the opportunity of NOT retiring. So now you are working for about (40-15)% of salary and that is before paying your marginal income tax on the additional earnings, dropping the value further! Finally, there are the other expenses of work clothes, special cleaning that is required, and the opportunity costs that working creates.
That's a good point, I currently contribute 8% to my pension, and social security tax, and I accrue 2.5% per year of service, so I only need to serve 35 years in order to match my take home salary in pension payments, and by that measure I can max out at age 69. It's possible to game the system by accepting a mid level administrative appointment just prior to retirement, which would increase the pensionable income basis from a 9 month academic year appointment to a 12 month calendar appointment.
Check the rules... some places will count your summer pay as well, not just your 9 month salary, so some on the Pension Plan work the last several summers to bump their pay. Also, check to see if there is a maximum number of years credit that you can apply. In other words, some places will not let you earn too much (ie replace your full wages... in other words, some places limit you to 30 years work credit TIMEs the % for each year worked)
In our defined benefit plan, the amount you can receive increases for years served up to 35. I don't know if people who serve longer have to still pay into the plan.
Quote from: aside on November 15, 2021, 11:28:41 AM
Working from home last year has taught me that I need not fear retirement. I will never be bored.
Nice insight. Such a realization sounds reassuring and positive.
This thread prompted me to email my director that I'll be fully retired in 3 years (Age 68). The last year I'll only work on the last grant that I am a co-investigator on so essentially done end of next year. I'm not too worried about being bored. I have some things I'd like to do in terms of adult learning and volunteer work. There is also a very good chance of another move on the horizon. One thing I have noticed since the Pandemic is that my energy level isn't what it was in my 50'x. Hopefully, the energy level won't go totally to zero anytime soon!
Quote from: Volhiker78 on November 17, 2021, 08:33:07 AM
This thread prompted me to email my director that I'll be fully retired in 3 years (Age 68). The last year I'll only work on the last grant that I am a co-investigator on so essentially done end of next year. I'm not too worried about being bored. I have some things I'd like to do in terms of adult learning and volunteer work. There is also a very good chance of another move on the horizon. One thing I have noticed since the Pandemic is that my energy level isn't what it was in my 50'x. Hopefully, the energy level won't go totally to zero anytime soon!
That is a very good call; when my energy levels decrease, I would likely want to slowly think of retirement, especially if a move is in horizon. Without a move or after one is completely exhausted, it wouldnt be the same.
Nice to see this thread back.
I'm 61 and last week I switched to part-time. A 60% (3 day a week) appointment. I'm academic staff, and I think I'm going to like this transition phase!
I had always thought I'd teach until 70. I have a very privileged position where I teach a light load of mostly what I want. I am having fun, why stop?
Recently though my university has encountered enormous challenges and dealt with them in the worst ways possible (see the rant I just posted in Colleges in Financial Straits...) and also I inherited a tidy sum that was not entirely expected. So I am reevaluating that 70 idea. I am 60 and probably could retire in three years.
I ran this idea past my wife, though, and she said I shouldn't do it. Why not I asked her? "You need an audience, Larry." she said. "It can't just be me."
So negotiations continue.
QuoteI ran this idea past my wife, though, and she said I shouldn't do it. Why not I asked her? "You need an audience, Larry." she said. "It can't just be me."
So negotiations continue.
Ive posted this before... advice from my retired department chair.
QuoteDont Retire FROM something, retire TO something! .... His other advice was "once you have enough money, why continue to work"?
What would you like to do?
It seems that you may be able to afford to retire. (Make sure that you have health insurance in place, as Medicare is 5 years off and it is pretty expensive at 60)
I dont know anyone that retired TO something that has regretted it. Most wonder why they waited and are busier now than they ever were while working.
Quote from: larryc on November 25, 2021, 02:18:13 PM
I ran this idea past my wife, though, and she said I shouldn't do it. Why not I asked her? "You need an audience, Larry." she said. "It can't just be me."
I laughed really hard at this! Feel the same way about my spouse, also an academic. He's a funny guy, but I can't replace his students, colleagues, and everybody he entertains all day.
He'll need a YouTube channel or similar for affirmation.
So at what age do you observe your colleagues retiring? Mine is a range from about 65 to 90+, most around 70s. It is an R1.
Quote from: Pomegranate on December 05, 2021, 09:49:38 PM
So at what age do you observe your colleagues retiring? Mine is a range from about 65 to 90+, most around 70s. It is an R1.
I see a big range here (Canadian research university). Most are beyond 65, but we had one recently retire around 60, but they had a company running in parallel the whole time, so they are only retired from here.
Quote from: Pomegranate on December 05, 2021, 09:49:38 PM
So at what age do you observe your colleagues retiring? Mine is a range from about 65 to 90+, most around 70s. It is an R1.
In the library world, usually at 65. They tend to have long retirements. Every so often the state library listserv mentions the death of some colleague who retired decades ago, before I even got into the business.
Quote from: Pomegranate on December 05, 2021, 09:49:38 PM
So at what age do you observe your colleagues retiring? Mine is a range from about 65 to 90+, most around 70s. It is an R1.
M8d-seventies (Canadian UG-only instiution akinto a community college).