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Cancelling Dr. Seuss

Started by apl68, March 12, 2021, 09:36:21 AM

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marshwiggle

Quote from: downer on July 19, 2022, 11:10:58 AM
Clearly, Amy Wax is a problem for the Penn Law School that the Dean wants to go away.

She is alleged to have said it is rational for her to fear being in elevators with black men.

Is it rational for black students to fear being in her classes? I wonder what the student teaching evaluations say. She certainly seems to favor a "harsh" approach rather than providing "warm" comments, looking at her RMP.


Keep in mind she's a law professor, teaching future lawyers. If there's a profession requiring people to have a thick skin and to be prepared to handle outrageous statements from other people, that would be it.
It takes so little to be above average.

Wahoo Redux

Dallas Morning News: LGBT students denounce UT-Dallas professor who wants 'a cure for homosexuality'

Quote
Students at the University of Texas at Dallas want action taken against a faculty member who is defending his comments calling for "cure for homosexuality."

vs.

The Advocate: Mark Ballard: Conservatives want to clip tenure protections for outspoken college professors

Quote
Louisiana began down what one legislator calls the "slippery slope" toward eliminating job-protecting tenure for college professors who mouth off in unapproved ways.
Behind a paywall, but I think you get the issue here...

Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

dismalist

#722
This sounds like Amy's case, somebody mouthing off outside their field of expertise. Given this guy is a Computer Science professor, what I said about Amy may well apply here, too.

Quote from: dismalist on July 19, 2022, 11:45:28 AM
Perhaps strangely, perhaps not, it looks to me like Amy is a piece of work!

Academic freedom to talk drivel is limited to talking drivel on one's own subject, in her case, the law. See AAUP statements on academic freedom of 1940:

QuoteTeachers are entitled to freedom in the classroom in discussing their subject, but they should be careful not to introduce into their teaching controversial matter which has no relation to their subject. Limitations of academic freedom because of religious or other aims of the institution should be clearly stated in writing at the time of the appointment.
Apparently, but only apparently she extends her reach a tad beyond the law.

In any case, perhaps Penn's statements on freedom of expression are narrower or broader than some on either side would like. I don't know. That is surely relevant for "extra-mural" statements, which Penn or any other private university can regulate however the hell it pleases. Maybe it's better phrased as an ex post vs ex ante question. Again, I don't know.

Without doing unbiased investigations it's hard to know all the detail of what's going on. Maybe some students just don't like her. Maybe she's acid. I don't know.
That's not even wrong!
--Wolfgang Pauli

Wahoo Redux

Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

dismalist

#724
Quote from: Wahoo Redux on July 21, 2022, 10:21:16 AM
Reddit: Is LinkedIn and all not my private business?

Some interesting responses.

The responses are the best part! They're pretty reasonable, even insightful.

Here, as with part of the Amy story, if true, the question is manners. In my yute I learned that one did not talk about sex, money, religion, or politics over dinner. Never mind that I thought then there's nothing interesting left to talk about, but I learned to keep my mouth shut about these subjects at dinner. There were other times and places these subjects could be talked about. One of the commenters says this about linked in.

This is not cancellation, as for speakers, or faculty at Georgetown.  This is about choosing what channel to make what comments on. God knows we have plenty.

Good manners will not save anyone from cancellation, but will save themselves a lot of other trouble.

That's not even wrong!
--Wolfgang Pauli

apl68

My understanding was that LinkedIn was a professional networking site, where rants and strong personal opinions would be a violation of norms.

The OP on that thread said "thanks" at one point.  I think the experience proved educational.  Sadder but wiser, maybe.
See, your King is coming to you, just and bringing salvation, gentle and lowly, and riding upon a donkey.

downer

I know one person on LinkedIn who poured scorn on administators from their previous place of employment. Probably with some justification. It was quite enjoyable to see. I don't think there were any consequences for the poster.
"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross."—Sinclair Lewis

Wahoo Redux

#727
IHE: Dissecting the Campus Speech Problem

Quote
"I understand what they're trying to do: they think conservative students feel uncomfortable in a classroom because their liberal professors are indoctrinating them. They think, 'If we just ban certain stuff from the classroom, we can address that problem,'" Young said.

The lawmakers promoting that point of view are wrong about the cause of the problem and they've chosen the wrong way to try to solve it, Young told the attendees—"but there is a problem."

"Students feel silenced," but it's generally not their professors doing the silencing, he said—it's mostly their fellow students, who are more comfortable than ever before with the idea of restricting speech to protect people.

"We can't ignore this problem," he said. "But we have to provide an alternative to banning speech."

I've said it before and I'll say it again: cutting what people can say swings all ways.
Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

marshwiggle

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on July 28, 2022, 09:05:20 AM
IHE: Dissecting the Campus Speech Problem


This is pretty disturbing:
Quote
Ashley Zohn, vice president for learning and impact at Knight, presented data from the foundation's annual survey of college students in 2021 that showed a minority of students (47 percent) feel that free speech rights are secure, down from 73 percent in 2016.

That's a huge change (73% to 47%) in 5 years, since that's only slightly longer than the time one student takes to get a degree. (If they get a Bachelor's and a Master's, then it's during one student's time at university.)
It takes so little to be above average.

Wahoo Redux

Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

marshwiggle

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on August 03, 2022, 07:18:20 PM
CBS: Ferris State Professor Settles for $95K

At least in this case, he was specifically addressing his students directly about matters related to them, and of an academic nature (such as grading), so scrutiny by the administration is appropriate.
It takes so little to be above average.

Wahoo Redux

Quote from: marshwiggle on August 04, 2022, 03:51:21 AM
Quote from: Wahoo Redux on August 03, 2022, 07:18:20 PM
CBS: Ferris State Professor Settles for $95K

At least in this case, he was specifically addressing his students directly about matters related to them, and of an academic nature (such as grading), so scrutiny by the administration is appropriate.

I watched part of the video.  I swear this guy was trying to get himself fired.  In a certain context it is hilarious, and I can imagine the kids from my hedonistic age (the '80s) getting a yuge kick out of it.
Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

onthefringe

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on August 04, 2022, 09:14:11 AM
Quote from: marshwiggle on August 04, 2022, 03:51:21 AM
Quote from: Wahoo Redux on August 03, 2022, 07:18:20 PM
CBS: Ferris State Professor Settles for $95K

At least in this case, he was specifically addressing his students directly about matters related to them, and of an academic nature (such as grading), so scrutiny by the administration is appropriate.

I watched part of the video.  I swear this guy was trying to get himself fired.  In a certain context it is hilarious, and I can imagine the kids from my hedonistic age (the '80s) getting a yuge kick out of it.

I watched the video too, and generally found it fairly harmless. I wouldn't do that much cursing (though the "plagiarism of Deadwood" thing was sort of inspired). I also wouldn't spend so much time talking about "Indians". The only thing I thought skirted inappropriate for the audience was the material about predetermined grades. It was funny and memorable, but if there's one sure-fire way to upset students, it's joking about grades.

The material about class attendance seemed designed to get a rise out of administration, rather than students. Not sure he was trying to get fired per se, but there was a certain level of "I'm retiring next year anyway, lets f$ck around and find out"

mahagonny

The Babylon Bee is banned from Tik Tok, and has already been banned from Twitter for not deleting a tweet. Tik Tok doesn't not believe they need to give a reason and they certainly don't, but I would be boycotting them now in response, except I can't because I've never used them.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/jul/5/christian-satire-site-babylon-bee-banned-without-e/

Wahoo Redux

Quote from: mahagonny on August 30, 2022, 03:23:58 AM
The Babylon Bee is banned from Tik Tok, and has already been banned from Twitter for not deleting a tweet. Tik Tok doesn't not believe they need to give a reason and they certainly don't, but I would be boycotting them now in response, except I can't because I've never used them.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/jul/5/christian-satire-site-babylon-bee-banned-without-e/

We are an increasingly offendable society.  I cannot imagine a Merry Prankster bus journey, the movies Animal House or Airplane, or the jokes in The National Lampoon being tolerated these days.

At the same time, a private corporate entity has no obligation to carry content it thinks will damage its image or business, including social media.  Free speech is also the freedom NOT to say something.  I know that enrages some Trumpees.
Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.