Hello: a student recently informed me that they saw one of our colleagues in a casino, gambling, and showed me a blurry picture of someone who looked like the professor. This colleague is a director of a small but well-funded research unit at the university. According to the student, they didn't "feel good" about seeing their professor gambling since it gives the wrong message. The student claimed they were not sure whether there is a code of conduct for faculty. So far, there have not been any issues with the Professor's handling of research/administrative funds.
How would you handle this observation from the student? What would you tell the student? Would you talk to the professor,? If so, what would you say?
best, Edison
Really? I'm thinking you're a troll.
Quote from: Hegemony on January 14, 2023, 02:25:45 AM
Really? I'm thinking you're a troll.
Well, they don't have a lot of posts, but there are 5 and the others involve departmental and service questions...
1. Unless you are at an institution with an explicitly religious mission, there wouldn't be any rule prohibiting legal gambling. The only real exceptions might involve sports betting and for faculty I can't imagine any rule would go beyond betting on the school's team.
2. Gambling, where there are casinos, is a highly regulated, legal, recreational activity. There's a reasonable argument to be had about whether that's a good thing, but except in very particular circumstances, what people do in their spare time shouldn't be something anybody at their job needs to care about.
3. Essentially this is the same as seeing a professor drinking at a bar and worrying that their drinking might cause problems at work. Most people who gamble have reasonable limits and aren't going to go into debt doing so. Some people get into real trouble, but there's no reason to assume your colleague has a gambling problem. The leap to worrying about your colleague embezzling money is just nuts.
Obviously, you shouldn't say anything to your colleague. As for what to tell the student, you should tell them them that their professors are allowed to have personal lives and that they shouldn't be taking pictures of people without their permission.
Look, being a faculty is the same as any other job out there. Are people that work at Walmart, Starbucks, Mc Donald's, tech companies, banking, investment banking, travel, hospitality, health care prohibited from gambling? Then why would a faculty member be prohibited?
We live in a country where people can have guns and this is a fundamental right protected by the constitution, but gambling legally at a casino is not?
Jesus Christ... What else am I going to hear in this country?
Maybe tell the student that if they do not want to see faculty at casinos, then they should not go to casinos in the first place (!?)
Quote from: research_prof on January 14, 2023, 06:54:31 AM
Maybe tell the student that if they do not want to see faculty at casinos, then they should not go to casinos in the first place (!?)
Well, yeah, that's what I was wondering. If the student thought gambling in a casino was unethical, what was
the student doing there?
It's none of your business. And none of the (hypocritical) student's. Obviously.
Your student should mind their own business. A college / university should not have a code of conduct applying off campus and outside working hours/official duties - I presume the casino in question ido. is off campus. Your student complaining about seeing people gambling at a casino would easily be solved by not going to casinos.
What's next? Complaining that a professor is on a dating app?
I am having pizza for lunch. Should I email my students first and ask them if they are ok with that?
Jesus Christ.. I still cannot believe what I read in this thread...
Quote from: marshwiggle on January 14, 2023, 07:26:39 AM
Quote from: research_prof on January 14, 2023, 06:54:31 AM
Maybe tell the student that if they do not want to see faculty at casinos, then they should not go to casinos in the first place (!?)
Well, yeah, that's what I was wondering. If the student thought gambling in a casino was unethical, what was the student doing there?
I was shocked and appalled when I saw my student at the opium den. Very inappropriate. Not good for the reputation of the school to have students be frequenting such places!
I have yet to bump into one of my students at the cannabis dispensary, but many of my colleagues shop there.
I avoid going out much during Pride Week (https://sfpride.org/) or the Folsom Street Fair. (https://www.folsomstreet.org/)
Mainly because I don't want to run into my students while they are naked.
(I'm never naked in public so no risk there...)
Maybe they were having a staycation?
I remember seeing one of my grade school teachers shopping in a supermarket when I was a little kid. She stopped and had a brief pleasant chat with my mom. My little head was blown. The teacher seemed so...human.
Many years later in grad school, I was shopping at our local supermarket and I ran into a student from a class I was TA-ing for. She said, "It is so weird to see a TA out shopping."
I can only imagine the decentering shock of seeing a professor---- A PROFESSOR, who is an ennobled member of society----actually gambling...
Quote from: Wahoo Redux on January 14, 2023, 02:07:38 PM
I remember seeing one of my grade school teachers shopping in a supermarket when I was a little kid. She stopped and had a brief pleasant chat with my mom. My little head was blown. The teacher seemed so...human.
Many years later in grad school, I was shopping at our local supermarket and I ran into a student from a class I was TA-ing for. She said, "It is so weird to see a TA out shopping."
I can only imagine the decentering shock of seeing a professor---- A PROFESSOR, who is an ennobled member of society----actually gambling...
When I was a TA, I ran into some of the students at a bar on Halloween. I was in a fairly ridiculous costume, and it was awesome....
Quote from: Kron3007 on January 14, 2023, 02:28:51 PM
When I was a TA, I ran into some of the students at a bar on Halloween. I was in a fairly ridiculous costume, and it was awesome....
When I was in high school, some of the older kids in my class discovered that the teaching assistant in our English class also stripped.
Then, as now, it seems to me that if someone is bothered about the discovery, they perhaps ought to reflect on what
they were doing inside that den of iniquity themselves.
Perhaps the student just thought they were supposed to do something, but regardless, just drop it, even if there is some sort of strict code of conduct. Theres no burden on the OP to crucify a colleague over s blurry picture.
The stories about teachers and what not that everyone has shared sound so nice, but let's get our stuff and realize that faculty are human beings and have personal lives. If students do not like that or are shocked with the discovery of faculty drinking, eating, stripping, being on dating apps, or going to casinos, they should talk to their mom/dad or a licensed mental health professional.
I would repeat: being a faculty is a job like every other.
MOST are human beings...some...I don't know what they are...
The only violation I see in this story is the Cell Phone Picture IN a casino!
Casinos are very protective and prohibit cameras as it is a security concern (no one wants to have pictures of the cameras, of the undercover folks, of the other security processes that may be exploited).
Taking pictures in a casino is a good way to get kicked out! And in places with legal casinos, the laws are on the side of the casinos! It may well be not just a casino policy to prohibit pictures, but a violation of the law!!
What would I do? Nothing is the best policy here! (As telling the student to 'grow up' or 'stay out of casinos' or 'mind your own business' or ask 'Why were YOU in the casino?' would probably not be in the best form of 'if you dont have anything nice/constructive to say, say nothing at all').
Hell, even nuns and priests drink wine, HOST bingo, and sometimes fund raise with Casino Nights!
In June 2014, American Library Assoc. (ALA) Annual went to Las Vegas for the 1st time since 1973. Some of us librarians hit the casinos after a day at the convention center.
Quote from: clean on January 14, 2023, 04:10:53 PM
The only violation I see in this story is the Cell Phone Picture IN a casino!
Casinos are very protective and prohibit cameras as it is a security concern (no one wants to have pictures of the cameras, of the undercover folks, of the other security processes that may be exploited).
Yeah, I was trying to take a picture of my wife at a slot machine and a very jovial security guard cut me off right away. His explanation was, "Mr. Jones [a hypothetical person] doesn't want a picture of himself gambling so his wife can see it." He was trying to make a joke out of the situation. Seemed like a sweet guy.
Truth is that pro scam artists can lean a great deal about slot machine mechanics, age, and so forth from a picture. They can actually plan on how to scam casinos with a photograph. I'm sure my wife and I looked like really dangerous characters.
Quote from: Wahoo Redux on January 14, 2023, 04:09:55 PM
MOST are human beings...some...I don't know what they are...
As in every profession out there...
Quote from: JohnEdison on January 13, 2023, 11:32:28 PM
Hello: a student recently informed me that they saw one of our colleagues in a casino, gambling, and showed me a blurry picture of someone who looked like the professor. This colleague is a director of a small but well-funded research unit at the university. According to the student, they didn't "feel good" about seeing their professor gambling since it gives the wrong message. The student claimed they were not sure whether there is a code of conduct for faculty. So far, there have not been any issues with the Professor's handling of research/administrative funds.
How would you handle this observation from the student? What would you tell the student? Would you talk to the professor,? If so, what would you say?
best, Edison
Tell the student to mind their own business.
One of my former colleagues worked as a stripper while she was in grad school. She wrote a book about the experiences called Neon Girls (https://www.harpercollins.com/products/neon-girls-jennifer-worley?variant=32206140571682) about their union drive. She later became president of our faculty union.
Quote from: ciao_yall on January 15, 2023, 10:05:25 AM
One of my former colleagues worked as a stripper while she was in grad school. She wrote a book about the experiences called Neon Girls (https://www.harpercollins.com/products/neon-girls-jennifer-worley?variant=32206140571682) about their union drive. She later became president of our faculty union.
It must be a genre. One of my former colleagues wrote a similar books: https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299 (https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299)
Quote from: jerseyjay on January 15, 2023, 11:50:19 AM
Quote from: ciao_yall on January 15, 2023, 10:05:25 AM
One of my former colleagues worked as a stripper while she was in grad school. She wrote a book about the experiences called Neon Girls (https://www.harpercollins.com/products/neon-girls-jennifer-worley?variant=32206140571682) about their union drive. She later became president of our faculty union.
It must be a genre. One of my former colleagues wrote a similar books: https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299 (https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299)
I guess that goes a step beyond mere "transparency" in grading.
Quote from: clean on January 14, 2023, 04:10:53 PM
Taking pictures in a casino is a good way to get kicked out! And in places with legal casinos, the laws are on the side of the casinos! It may well be not just a casino policy to prohibit pictures, but a violation of the law!!
I doubt it would usually be against the law unless you were doing it for the purpose of cheating. The casino can certainly toss you out for violating their policies, however, and have you arrested for trespassing if you return.
Quote from: marshwiggle on January 16, 2023, 07:32:07 AM
Quote from: jerseyjay on January 15, 2023, 11:50:19 AM
Quote from: ciao_yall on January 15, 2023, 10:05:25 AM
One of my former colleagues worked as a stripper while she was in grad school. She wrote a book about the experiences called Neon Girls (https://www.harpercollins.com/products/neon-girls-jennifer-worley?variant=32206140571682) about their union drive. She later became president of our faculty union.
It must be a genre. One of my former colleagues wrote a similar books: https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299 (https://www.amazon.com/Naked-best-disguise-life-stripper/dp/0688029299)
I guess that goes a step beyond mere "transparency" in grading.
Ha!
I have a colleague who claims to have seen a student at a strip club, on stage. I don't remember the details exactly, but I'm sure it was an awkward encounter.
Thank you all for your input. Indeed, I am not a troll. I found the student's complaint rather weird and thought I could share it with my esteemed colleagues. But I agree with you all. I told the student that "Professors are individuals, and deserve their private lives too, just as you do. I don't remember if there are any codes of ethics, but if there are you, the student body would know about it".
Happy MLK Day !.
cheers, Edison
I used to work for the Feds and even then our only code of conduct rule that went beyond what was lawful was driving a Federal vehicle to a casino or strip club.
I used to work as a lifeguard and swim instructor on weekends while in grad school and would occasionally see pool patrons in the grocery store or other places. It was funny how often the littler kids thought that I lived in a swimsuit - it was a little more awkward when one of the parents remarked "I didn't recognize you with your clothes on".
When I was in college I ran into a prof at a casino a couple times.
After that, every time I saw him he kept wanting to share his awful illogical gambling theories with me (different versions of martingale "strategy").
Super awkward, but I sure as hell never thought to report him for anything!!
Quote from: fizzycist on January 19, 2023, 09:25:05 PM
When I was in college I ran into a prof at a casino a couple times.
After that, every time I saw him he kept wanting to share his awful illogical gambling theories with me (different versions of martingale "strategy").
Super awkward, but I sure as hell never thought to report him for anything!!
Our society today is different. This is good when it comes to important matters like equity, social justice, etc. This is not good though when we have become overly sensitive for things that really do not matter.
Faculty are individuals who have personal lives as well. They are not some other sort of spiritual entities that eat and drink "science" and the only thing that they do all day is "science". They are not psychologists as well. I have seen some students (even graduate ones) confusing that. Being a faculty is like every other job. When you leave work, you can do whatever the heck you like.
Quote from: fizzycist on January 19, 2023, 09:25:05 PM
When I was in college I ran into a prof at a casino a couple times.
After that, every time I saw him he kept wanting to share his awful illogical gambling theories with me (different versions of martingale "strategy").
Super awkward, but I sure as hell never thought to report him for anything!!
You should have at least reported him for being a mathematical idiot.
i hope he wasnt your Stats professor.
Quote from: Ruralguy on January 20, 2023, 08:32:20 PM
i hope he wasnt your Stats professor.
This is the best answer. The only time I'd be worried.
Quote from: Ruralguy on January 20, 2023, 08:32:20 PM
i hope he wasnt your Stats professor.
Maybe he counted cards...