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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: PI on July 12, 2021, 06:01:39 AM

Title: Vacation home/investment
Post by: PI on July 12, 2021, 06:01:39 AM
We have been thinking on and off about a vacation home (which will be also an investment) to go out of the busy city area a couple of weeks a month. However, we are also very busy with young children.  With kids activities that often happen on weekends, we may not really be able to get there too often once everything becomes in-person. But we also feel like we need to get out of the city and hope to have a place of our own instead of finding hotels/bnb.

Is this a bad idea for tenure track professors to try and get a second home?  What would be an optimal distance? We are also debating between country home with acreage (negatives - too quiet and nothing going on) or a nearby city (few hours away) with better access to large state parks. All in all, it seems stressful to just consider this option and find something. As an added note, we don't have any debts and feel that we can afford it. It is not clear if it is a good investment though.

Any  suggestions/warning based on your experience or someone you know of?
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Puget on July 12, 2021, 06:27:14 AM
Assuming here you are in the US-- This seems like a terrible time to buy anything if you don't have to most places-- inventory is low, prices are high. Buying in what is almost certainly a housing bubble would make it a very bad investment. Plus, what happens if you don't get tenure or decide to leave for another job?

Also, it doesn't sound like you really know what you want yet. You say you don't want to rent, but why not? You could do a lot of weekend get-aways for way less than even a down payment, you wouldn't have to deal with the headaches of maintaining a house that sits empty most of the time, and you would have more variety. It sounds like you should at least try out spending weekends different places until you hit on someplace you know you want to return to regularly.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Caracal on July 12, 2021, 06:44:02 AM
Quote from: PI on July 12, 2021, 06:01:39 AM
We have been thinking on and off about a vacation home (which will be also an investment) to go out of the busy city area a couple of weeks a month. However, we are also very busy with young children.  With kids activities that often happen on weekends, we may not really be able to get there too often once everything becomes in-person. But we also feel like we need to get out of the city and hope to have a place of our own instead of finding hotels/bnb.

Is this a bad idea for tenure track professors to try and get a second home?  What would be an optimal distance? We are also debating between country home with acreage (negatives - too quiet and nothing going on) or a nearby city (few hours away) with better access to large state parks. All in all, it seems stressful to just consider this option and find something. As an added note, we don't have any debts and feel that we can afford it. It is not clear if it is a good investment though.

Any  suggestions/warning based on your experience or someone you know of?

I can't see how it really makes sense to think of a second home primarily as an investment. If you compare it to other places you could put your money, you are taking on far more risk. There are also likely to be extra costs associated with a second home, especially one you may not visit for long stretches of time. You'll probably have to hire someone to cut grass, shovel snow etc., for example and check in occasionally to make sure nothing has gone wrong.

Personally, I would concentrate on whether I wanted to have a vacation home and see any potential investment benefits as a possible bonus.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Hibush on July 12, 2021, 07:44:43 AM
If the second house gets your kids out of scheduled weekends into unstructured nature play, the time and money spent on it will have been worth it.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Morden on July 12, 2021, 07:59:45 AM
We have had a vacation home for over a decade, and its value has gone up substantially over that time. We love it.

But it's exhausting having two places to take care of; it's expensive to insure because it's empty much of the time; actually, it's expensive full stop because of utilities, taxes, etc.; and it means we don't go anywhere else for vacations because there is always something we need to do.




Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Diogenes on July 12, 2021, 08:01:39 AM
We are a childfree couple and have been close to doing this also- just waiting for the right house in the area we want. Our plan is to have it be our vacation home for now then our retirement home.
A couple big things you need to consider is the cost of maintenance of a second house (utilities, lawn, snow removal...) If you want to offset the cost when not using it, you should look into the ability for you to rent/AirBnB it. Many vacation areas are cracking down on short term rentals since AirBnB is taking so much of the rental stock off the market that the service class depends on.
Another thing to think about is the cost of selling if you need to. Generally, you have to prove the house was your primary residence for at least two years prior to selling if you don't want to pay sales tax on the property. That can be a huge hit.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: ciao_yall on July 12, 2021, 08:15:59 AM
Quote from: PI on July 12, 2021, 06:01:39 AM
We have been thinking on and off about a vacation home (which will be also an investment) to go out of the busy city area a couple of weeks a month. However, we are also very busy with young children.  With kids activities that often happen on weekends, we may not really be able to get there too often once everything becomes in-person. But we also feel like we need to get out of the city and hope to have a place of our own instead of finding hotels/bnb.

Is this a bad idea for tenure track professors to try and get a second home?  What would be an optimal distance? We are also debating between country home with acreage (negatives - too quiet and nothing going on) or a nearby city (few hours away) with better access to large state parks. All in all, it seems stressful to just consider this option and find something. As an added note, we don't have any debts and feel that we can afford it. It is not clear if it is a good investment though.

Any  suggestions/warning based on your experience or someone you know of?

Consider doing short-term rentals in various places where you might want a vacation home. Easy to fix meals in rather than paying for restaurants all the time, plus you can adapt to your kids' preferences and energy levels.

You might find you really enjoy having your choice of places to go. Your kids, as they grow, might have changes in their interests that would make different places more appealing to your family as the years go by.

Or, you might find you really want to put down roots in a particular community, and your kids might appreciate the familiarity. You won't know until you have tried a lot of options.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mamselle on July 12, 2021, 08:47:05 AM
The clearest situation I can recall that made sense to me, on the outside looking in, was one of my thesis readers who celebrated being named a full professor by buying a second home in a much-vaunted getaway area in my state.

This meant they were older, had been saving for years, and had done much of what is advised above in terms of trying out different locations, etc.

They were also an architecture history/domestic material culture couple who knew exactly the value of the place they bought, its surroundings, etc., and who planned, also as noted above, to make it a retirement home, with timeshare rentals in-between then and the time they bought it.

N=1, of course.

M.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: jimbogumbo on July 12, 2021, 09:05:40 AM
I agree with Puget completely. Now is not the time. Just use VRBO or Airbnb until the market inventory catches up to demand.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Anselm on July 12, 2021, 10:07:05 AM
How about just plain undeveloped land?  You can always camp out there and the land itself can be an investment.  My parents had a vacation trailer in a big campground.  I remember always having to work during every visit.   It did not seem worth it to me.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mythbuster on July 12, 2021, 10:29:00 AM
My grandparents owned a condo in a beachside town approximately 4 hours from where the greater family lived. Being a condo meant the upkeep was generally taken care of, but there were big issues within the family over whether this was an income property or a vacation home. Grandpa wanted to treat is an an income property- which meant having it rented out to non-family members during the peak seasons. Grandma wanted it as a vacation property for the entire family to use for free.  As you can predict, arguments arose when some family member would ask to "use" the unit during the summer- negating the income potential during that time.
  So decide which you want in advance. If you want to rent it out part of the time, you need to decide in advance when those times will be and when you want the place for yourself.
   My mother never wanted a vacation home because then she said she would feel obligated to always go there! I think the experience with the family beach condo (sold off once the grandparents passed) influenced her thinking on this.
   
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mamselle on July 12, 2021, 11:03:53 AM
Also, there may be strong gender divisions on this, if the family involved sticks to certain entrenched expecations.

It's harder to pack up a home and move temporarily to another one, and pack up all the kids, if kids there be, pets likewise, etc.

Those jobs have traditionally fallen to the female side of a family, and weigh in at about 10 x the amount it might take the male to pack for themselves and move a few boxes of groceries in.

Just thinking...this may not apply to your family, but I can see it being an unspoken issue if said female is just assumed to be taking on all those tasks.

M. 
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: spork on July 12, 2021, 11:06:34 AM
Max out your annual 403b and Roth IRA contributions first.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Hegemony on July 12, 2021, 11:29:43 AM
It won't be an investment. At best it may earn back some of its keep, if you are in a popular area for AirBnBs and can navigate the hassles. This would include having to go in and clean between visitors, or hiring someone reliable to do it.

I do have a second house, and I know a lot of academics who do. They're generally more senior in their careers. It is definitely most important to fund your retirement abundantly before you contemplate a second home. Then you have to regard the home as a luxury, like a boat. It consumes money. Ours is worth it, but it's important not to regard it as an investment. It could increase in value and give you a profit (or allow you to break even) decades from now — but also it could not.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mamselle on July 12, 2021, 11:47:13 AM
Now remembering several such scenarios on the old forum, too....people traveling to and from houses given the season, or where they were teaching, etc.

Sounded very work-y to me, and I know I remember that a couple of their houses, when sold, didn't turn a profit; in one case just went for taxes.

Sorry--Wet blankets and all that...

M. 
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: downer on July 12, 2021, 12:12:26 PM
The people I know with hoiiday homes often share ownership with family members, so different family members can visit at different times, and share the work on upkeep. They also sometimes allow friends to stay.

If you wanted an investment, you might try letting it out on Airbnb yourself when you are not using it. But that would take a lot of coordinating with/employing others to prepare it between visits of guests. Quite likely more trouble than it is worth.

There do seem to be 2 different sorts of people. Those who like to go to the same place every time during their downtime, and those who want to explore new places. I'm in the latter group. I'd get bored going back to the same place regularly.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: PI on July 12, 2021, 01:32:41 PM
Thank you all. These are great suggestions and comments. The whole idea was due to COVID and being stuck in a city with little access to nature, wanting to get closer to nature for us and the kids. Investing in land was another thought. Lots to think here... Once we come out of COVID and begin traveling again, these thoughts may vanish.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mamselle on July 12, 2021, 01:34:57 PM
If that's the issue, rent a trailer or buy a large tent, maybe?

M.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Ruralguy on July 12, 2021, 02:04:50 PM
Beach communities are expensive, but there's a big differences between, say, a condo in a southern beach town and a house in the Hamptons and both of these are very different from various mountain resorts. Any of them *can* be an investment, but whether they are depends on demands in that region, etc. and what you have to spend. You can probably track the usual real estate websites for a while to get a sense of appreciation.

In any case, my wife and I have a version of the former (condo in southern beach town, outside the super-luxury areas). I'd say it can be manageable in terms of price and mortgage and all, but probably only if your primary home isn't too burdensome. Also, you'd likely have to be a dual income family. Also, we only have one child, so only have to deal with one kids activities. If you have several kids with differing interests, I can see how it might almost be worthless to you to have such a home since you'd rarely be there. Also, if you don't like a certain area, such as the beach, so much that you'd want to go there more than anywhere else, its probably not worth it. Keep  in mind that most condos will have very large outlays every few years for various repairs (probably at least 10-20 K or so). Then again, so would a lot of primary homes.  Our place is about 3 hours from our regular home. I think more than 4 probably makes it not so worth it for weekend trips. Though we don't formally share in the upkeep , etc., we have let some close friends occaissionally stay there when we aren't there. It probably has gained in value more than what we have spent on such outlays, so, in that sense, a profitable investment, but honestly, putting money in boring REITs would be a considerably better, or at least less risky, real estate investment. 
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Puget on July 12, 2021, 02:35:13 PM
Quote from: PI on July 12, 2021, 01:32:41 PM
Thank you all. These are great suggestions and comments. The whole idea was due to COVID and being stuck in a city with little access to nature, wanting to get closer to nature for us and the kids. Investing in land was another thought. Lots to think here... Once we come out of COVID and begin traveling again, these thoughts may vanish.

I'm all for contact with nature, and I would personally hate feeling trapped in a big city. But don't make decisions based on the past year-- a lot of people have done that (buying sub-optimal houses at inflated prices far from work just to get into a house and on the sometimes mistaken theory they would keep working from home) and are now regretting it. See if you still want to to this in a year, after renting in your possible locations.

Also, if you want to spend time in nature, there's no better way than camping (or better yet backpacking)-- You'll spend your weekends truly unplugged and spending time together outside instead of doing maintenance on the second home.  And its virtually free! Well, after the initial gear investment, but that's small potatoes compared to a second home. Do invest in quality gear so you have a good experience -- a leaky tent or not warm enough sleeping bags will ruin it for everyone. Do it right and you'll imprint your kids for life (worked on me anyway).
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Vkw10 on July 12, 2021, 05:31:27 PM
Quote from: PI on July 12, 2021, 01:32:41 PM
Thank you all. These are great suggestions and comments. The whole idea was due to COVID and being stuck in a city with little access to nature, wanting to get closer to nature for us and the kids. Investing in land was another thought. Lots to think here... Once we come out of COVID and begin traveling again, these thoughts may vanish.

Check out state park cabin rentals. A cabin usually costs my family about $500 for a week. Two bedrooms, bath, kitchen, living area, porch, grill, and nature galore. We reserve cabins several months in advance, for familial visits to SC, KS, and TX. Many of the parks we visit have lakes for swimming, kayaking, and fishing. Some include linens and basic kitchen gear (SC and TX).
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Hegemony on July 12, 2021, 07:09:29 PM
In favor of the idea, I'll say that our country home has been a sanity-saver in these last months — and in fact always. The house is on the edge of a lovely wilderness and in fact I just spent a good portion of the evening in the rocker on the porch admiring the fireflies and listening to the frogs.

Other benefits: you know exactly what you're getting — what facilities are in the kitchen, that there's a washing machine, what amenities are nearby, etc. You can revisit old favorite haunts. You can leave stuff there (clothes, gadgets, whatever) between times. You don't have to pack a ton because you have plenty of stuff at the summer place. You don't have to clean within an inch of your life upon leaving or be charged a fee. You know it accepts pets, if you have pets. Your pets may grow very fond of it. You can develop ties with people in the community. And you can certainly still go other places — but you have one place you know you can always go.

It's a great thing to have if you can swing it. Just separate the luxury part from the investment part.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: PI on July 12, 2021, 08:00:32 PM
So may great suggestions here.

Vkw10: State park cabins seem like a great idea. We had not thought about that. Will be trying that out soon.

We had tried camping in the past but it does not work well with our family- at least yet. We enjoy hiking in the wilderness though.

Hegemony: What you describe is what we are dreaming of. Wilderness, porch, rocker...sounds great. May I ask if you chose a place with a lot of land or just enough for privacy. How do you manage the upkeep of yard or land? Did you choose something closer to a small town center or in a very rural area far from the center of some (small) town? How far is it from your primary residence? Do you get there every weekend? Do you have school aged children? So many questions..
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: clean on July 12, 2021, 09:42:06 PM
QuoteIs this a bad idea for tenure track professors

Am I the first to note "tenure track"?  Now is not the time to invest in big, illiquid, second homes! 

After tenure, you can consider such things, but until then, it may well be a mistake.  You dont want to have your time tied up on a second property when you may need to be free to work on another paper.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Hegemony on July 12, 2021, 11:47:55 PM
Quote from: PI on July 12, 2021, 08:00:32 PM

Hegemony: What you describe is what we are dreaming of. Wilderness, porch, rocker...sounds great. May I ask if you chose a place with a lot of land or just enough for privacy. How do you manage the upkeep of yard or land? Did you choose something closer to a small town center or in a very rural area far from the center of some (small) town? How far is it from your primary residence? Do you get there every weekend? Do you have school aged children? So many questions..

Our house was chosen for us, because it is a house built by the ancestors six generations back, which I have known from a child and bought from a cousin. It is just at the edge of a small town and has acres of lawn, woods, and stream, and backs onto a wild area and farmland. And handily it is in a great small town within easy range of a great medium-sized town, and not too far from the state capital. Unfortunately it is a plane flight away from my job. In normal years we come for 8-10 weeks, spread out over the year, mostly a big chunk in the summer. We spent a year here on sabbatical and son spent the year at the local school, which was a great experience. Right now we are here for eight months, through some cagy arranging on my part. I have local friends who help look after it when we are not here, and hire a local gardener. It helps that everyone in town has known our family for umpteen generations, so they have been very welcoming and very helpful. But despitel the insular reputation of small towns, in this one, at least, I see them being welcoming to other newcomers as well.

Some friends of mine have their second home in Hawaii; others have a medieval cottage in a small village in the south of France; another has a condo in Seattle; another's second home is an apartment in San Diego. All those folks have made it work. But I think the key is to be solvent before starting — it's not something you want to have to stretch to do.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: mamselle on July 13, 2021, 06:08:39 AM
The "southern French medieval cottage" made me smile.

A friend's parents recently sold them their "family cottage," the turret of a small walled city near Grenoble, originally set up for garreting troops, with a huge open central space that the mom (a large-scale sculptural installation artist, most often seen with a blow-torch on a scaffold in front of a colossal bronze abstract) filled with a mobile of white shells--thousands of them on white fishing lines, descsending to the floors below--and upon whose flat stone roof one could spread out sleeping bags and doze off under the stars.

The three days we spent there were enchanting, including the first morning, when, sent out to buy the day's bread supply, I got lost and wandered all through the spiral streets, down to the main gate and back up again, because there were five more identical towers, and we'd arrived at night, so I had to get oriented to find "ours."

The bread stayed warm until I got there.

M.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: PI on July 13, 2021, 06:17:01 AM
@clean, I should have said tenured.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: clean on July 13, 2021, 06:39:13 AM
Quote@clean, I should have said tenured.

Ok, well that is solved anyway.

My next thoughts are these:
Financial.
Are you otherwise debt free?
Is your retirement savings where you think that it should be?
Is college paid for?
Do you have an emergency fund of 6 months (or more) of expenses?

Time/consistency.
Are you sure that this is where you are going to want to spend your vacation for the foreseeable future?  (once you buy this, there wont be money available for other things?  NO Cruise to Alaska, no trip to Disney World, no big Spring Break trips, no long Summer road trip to visit a dozen future college destinations, no camp the national parks with the kids.... This is it! 
Along those lines, while I am a huge Disney fan, the people who buy those Disney Time Shares have locked in their vacation plans To DISNEY for quite some time and what may be a fun trip for the 12 and under crowd is something different for the 14-17 year old crowd (that doesnt want to admit that that they HAVE parents, much less be seen with them).

But IF you Have the money, particularly if you dont have to borrow a lot (or at all), then if you have the money in cash, then that is your decision!  (remember, just because a bank is willing to lend you the money, doesnt mean that you 'can afford it!')

Good luck.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: lightning on July 13, 2021, 11:00:39 AM
Quote from: Diogenes on July 12, 2021, 08:01:39 AM
We are a childfree couple and have been close to doing this also- just waiting for the right house in the area we want. Our plan is to have it be our vacation home for now then our retirement home.
A couple big things you need to consider is the cost of maintenance of a second house (utilities, lawn, snow removal...) If you want to offset the cost when not using it, you should look into the ability for you to rent/AirBnB it. Many vacation areas are cracking down on short term rentals since AirBnB is taking so much of the rental stock off the market that the service class depends on.
Another thing to think about is the cost of selling if you need to. Generally, you have to prove the house was your primary residence for at least two years prior to selling if you don't want to pay sales tax on the property. That can be a huge hit.

^This^

Taxes are the main reason I never purchased a second home, even though I've had these exact same conversations with myself. Also, my dear old Dad lost his shirt on his money pit second home, so I'm in fear of being one of the unlucky ones, too.

I rent, even though I also have conversations with myself about how much money I have lost because I rent my summer abode.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: dismalist on July 13, 2021, 02:24:18 PM
A dream of mine has long been this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSMwp4iRl2s&list=RDCMUC_-x5Cm8qwyGUAYVSfieEuw&index=2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSMwp4iRl2s&list=RDCMUC_-x5Cm8qwyGUAYVSfieEuw&index=2), more about cooking, and the larger location https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJ-BZjopP4I&list=RDCMUC_-x5Cm8qwyGUAYVSfieEuw&index=12 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJ-BZjopP4I&list=RDCMUC_-x5Cm8qwyGUAYVSfieEuw&index=12), in the Italian Alps.

Alas, dreams must often remain dreams.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Morris Zapp on July 13, 2021, 03:49:16 PM
Optimal distance is an hour and a half. I can get in the car in my jammies and make it all the way to our second house without having to stop anywhere along the way to pee, etc. If you take the dog you can also make it the whole way without pit stops. It's also a good distance for a quick trip to supervise a repair, or if you leave your cell phone on the kitchen table by accident (ahem).

We love our vacation house but didn't buy until we were empty nesters. We also bought a fixer upper so spent way too many restful weekends laying tile and flooring and painting. It was cheap because it was a dump which means we don't have to airbnb it, etc. I love the short distance and not having to pack. We just keep old clothes there, etc

Biggest hassle is remembering what you left in the fridge. Seriously thinking of getting a "smart" fridge.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Hegemony on July 13, 2021, 04:38:12 PM
I have two suggestions for having a vacation home:

1) Prepare two list prints-outs: "When Arriving" and "Before Leaving." Post them on the fridge or by the back door. They should be things like:

1. Turn off hot water heater in basement, number 13 on circuit breaker.
2. Take all trash.
3. Check fridge for perishables.
[etc.]

2) Get the same microwave for your regular house and your vacation house. This saves you having to peer at the microwave in the new place saying to yourself: "How in the heck do I heat water? Which one do I press??"
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: Morden on July 13, 2021, 08:24:40 PM
QuoteOptimal distance is an hour and a half.

I'm jealous. We are an eight hour drive/one hour flight away. It's too far/expensive for regular weekends. But sometimes if you want a significantly different environment, that's what you get.

OP, as you think it over, maybe imagine what your kids are likely to want now, in 5 years, in 10 years. We've noticed that families with kids often go through dramatic usage changes as the kids age--including years where the teens don't want to come out at all and then again later when the kids want to be there without the parents.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: apl68 on July 14, 2021, 06:55:48 AM
Nobody has yet mentioned an increasingly important consideration when it comes to beachfront properties--will the property still be there in 15-20-30 years' time?  It is becoming increasingly apparent that many beachfront properties in the U.S., especially in Florida and Louisiana, won't be.  No, they won't be submerged like Atlantis, but even eight inches or so of sea level rise--and some places are looking at as much as a foot and a half within the next two decades--can make some properties so flood-prone at every high tide and moderate storm as to be effectively untenable, unless there's work done to jack up the whole house and flood-proof all necessary roads and utilities. 

Many Florida beachfront communities worry that within a few more years the dawning realization that these properties are no longer good long-term investments will become so widespread that it will torpedo the property values that support most of their tax bases, just as they're really going to need more money to raise roads, build sea walls, etc. to adapt.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: downer on July 14, 2021, 09:30:52 AM
Quote from: apl68 on July 14, 2021, 06:55:48 AM
Nobody has yet mentioned an increasingly important consideration when it comes to beachfront properties--will the property still be there in 15-20-30 years' time?  It is becoming increasingly apparent that many beachfront properties in the U.S., especially in Florida and Louisiana, won't be.  No, they won't be submerged like Atlantis, but even eight inches or so of sea level rise--and some places are looking at as much as a foot and a half within the next two decades--can make some properties so flood-prone at every high tide and moderate storm as to be effectively untenable, unless there's work done to jack up the whole house and flood-proof all necessary roads and utilities. 

Many Florida beachfront communities worry that within a few more years the dawning realization that these properties are no longer good long-term investments will become so widespread that it will torpedo the property values that support most of their tax bases, just as they're really going to need more money to raise roads, build sea walls, etc. to adapt.

I agree with all of this. But in turn, the problem of climate refugees will be so major by then, with huge political ramifications, that we can expect economic and political turmoil.

So maybe live for the present and let the future look after itself.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: dismalist on July 14, 2021, 09:53:39 AM
QuoteNobody has yet mentioned an increasingly important consideration when it comes to beachfront properties--will the property still be there in 15-20-30 years' time?

That will be in the price.
Title: Re: Vacation home/investment
Post by: lightning on July 14, 2021, 11:52:26 AM
Quote from: downer on July 14, 2021, 09:30:52 AM
Quote from: apl68 on July 14, 2021, 06:55:48 AM
Nobody has yet mentioned an increasingly important consideration when it comes to beachfront properties--will the property still be there in 15-20-30 years' time?  It is becoming increasingly apparent that many beachfront properties in the U.S., especially in Florida and Louisiana, won't be.  No, they won't be submerged like Atlantis, but even eight inches or so of sea level rise--and some places are looking at as much as a foot and a half within the next two decades--can make some properties so flood-prone at every high tide and moderate storm as to be effectively untenable, unless there's work done to jack up the whole house and flood-proof all necessary roads and utilities. 

Many Florida beachfront communities worry that within a few more years the dawning realization that these properties are no longer good long-term investments will become so widespread that it will torpedo the property values that support most of their tax bases, just as they're really going to need more money to raise roads, build sea walls, etc. to adapt.

I agree with all of this. But in turn, the problem of climate refugees will be so major by then, with huge political ramifications, that we can expect economic and political turmoil.

So maybe live for the present and let the future look after itself.

Some climate refugees, anticipating the future, became mountain people <ahem>. Now some of those mountain people out west are getting scorched.