One of the drawbacks of booking a basic economy ticket on most airlines is that you don't get to pick your seat, and you won't know your seat until check-in. The risk for families is that they will end up getting broken up and getting seated apart from each other.
Being the cheapskate that I am, when I fly with any of my Lighting children, I go ahead and use basic economy for myself and the Lightning Children. Every single time that I have done that over the last five years, we all end up getting seated together anyway. This is even on the budget screw-you airlines like Frontier.
The airlines can't possibly be doing that because they are being nice. I'm guessing that they are doing that because they don't want any children being un-supervised and disruptive to other passengers and turning airline employees into babysitters.
Sooooo, has anyone done what I do to save money when flying with young children? I'm ready to call my maneuver a travel hack, if others have done something similar.
I have indeed been seated apart from my young child (age 4), so I don't think it's surefire. But I guess it's an occasional money-saver if you can endure Basic Economy.
Quote from: lightning on August 03, 2023, 11:53:49 AMOne of the drawbacks of booking a basic economy ticket on most airlines is that you don't get to pick your seat, and you won't know your seat until check-in. The risk for families is that they will end up getting broken up and getting seated apart from each other.
Being the cheapskate that I am, when I fly with any of my Lighting children, I go ahead and use basic economy for myself and the Lightning Children. Every single time that I have done that over the last five years, we all end up getting seated together anyway. This is even on the budget screw-you airlines like Frontier.
The airlines can't possibly be doing that because they are being nice. I'm guessing that they are doing that because they don't want any children being un-supervised and disruptive to other passengers and turning airline employees into babysitters.
Sooooo, has anyone done what I do to save money when flying with young children? I'm ready to call my maneuver a travel hack, if others have done something similar.
Nay, nay, nay! If there's something you don't understand about pricing, it's probably price discrimination! :-)
What's going on here? Those that feel better sitting next to their kids with certainty upgrade to premium economy for a higher price. Those that are willing to risk it, like you and me, get to pay the lower price.
Price discrimination adds to profits. It's possible because of limited competition. Just like higher ed.
I should add that (in my own experiences), when I fly with aforementioned young children AND SO, the SO insists* on paying the premium for selecting seats in advance. It's only when it's just me and the young children (no SO on the plane), where I buy Basic Economy, but the little Lightnings sit next to me, anyway, even without advance seat selection.
<Humph> * The SO also insists on paying for the so-called Premium seats (but not 1st class, Thank god) located towards the front of the plane with more leg room, earlier boarding, and other perks that I don't think are worth it but whatever).
I have personally been on a flight where my two options appeared to be to move from the window seat I paid extra for into a middle seat elsewhere on the plane or fly next to an unaccompanied four year old whose parent is in a middle seat elsewhere on the plane. It's not a (good) travel hack to risk putting other people in that position.
For the record I moved and hope that the karma point accrued, because it was extremely annoying to pay extra and still end up less comfortable.
Quote from: Hegemony on August 03, 2023, 12:02:08 PMI have indeed been seated apart from my young child (age 4), so I don't think it's surefire. But I guess it's an occasional money-saver if you can endure Basic Economy.
Quote from: onthefringe on August 03, 2023, 01:15:57 PMI have personally been on a flight where my two options appeared to be to move from the window seat I paid extra for into a middle seat elsewhere on the plane or fly next to an unaccompanied four year old whose parent is in a middle seat elsewhere on the plane.
I don't see how that can be legal. 0_o
Not having them seated with both parents, fine. But with
neither one? Quite apart from that being a nightmare for everyone involved, if anything at all should happen (even quite minor), the exposure in a lawsuit would be horrific. I'm willing to believe there's a cutoff, but it can't be four! I imagine no waivers were signed, either, so the airline assumes all responsibility...
Not having flown for a long while, I did not realize how fine the price discrimination on flights has become. Paying extra for a window seat!
The technique used by airlines is called third-degree price discrimination. With airlines, the idea is to make the lowest priced service so uncomfortable that only the heartiest few will use it. Clearly, there are many ways to torture customers. Works only with limited competition, of course.
Higher ed is way ahead of airlines. We apply first degree price discrimination already. Everybody pays a different price! Can you imagine if airlines could get our tax statements and decide what to charge each of us on that basis?
But we could additionally apply so-called two-part pricing, as in Disney World. You pay an entrance fee and then you pay extra for the rides. What we gotta do to maximize revenue in higher ed is to charge an entrance fee, tuition, for everybody, and then charge extra for each class or even section! No more getting locked out of sections. Hell, we could charge extra extra for particular seats!
I flew a number of times last month and saw young children scattered all over planes, away from their parents/guardians.
Quote from: dismalist on August 03, 2023, 02:03:11 PMWhat we gotta do to maximize revenue in higher ed is to charge an entrance fee, tuition, for everybody, and then charge extra for each class or even section! No more getting locked out of sections. Hell, we could charge extra extra for particular seats!
This is brilliant!
The hopeful me asks, Would students in the comfort-plus sections pay attention more because they paid for special treatment?
The practical me asks, While the back row seats would cost the most, would front-row seats also have a premium for the eager beavers?
A lot of behavioral economics experimets are possible too...
Could we fill 8 am sections by having no extra charge?
Would students on financial aid get vouchers good for a few premium sections each semester, or would we relegate them to the poor-folks sections? Both policies have a strong theoretical basis, but rather different proponents.
QuoteThe practical me asks, While the back row seats would cost the most, would front-row seats also have a premium for the eager beavers?
I've racked my brains about that one. My guess is that both the front and back would sell at a premium, but that there will be fewer in-demand seats in the front. Hard to gauge relative prices and quantities in a situation where customers do not differ monotonically.
Only one answer: Auction off the seats! :-)
Quote"Could we fill 8 am sections by having no extra charge?"
That would answer the 8AM question, too!
Quote"Would students on financial aid get vouchers good for a few premium sections each semester, or would we relegate them to the poor-folks sections? Both policies have a strong theoretical basis, but rather different proponents."
Financial aidees are a good question. I would say whatever monies above the entrance fee are given to the financial aidees they can spend as they wish for courses and seats. Those who give money now could decide how much, as they do now.
What should not be forgotten is the good side of price discrimination: It increases quantity. More people can afford to fly and more can go to college under price discrimination than without it.
To actually implement such a scheme, I suppose we could hire a Disney manager. An airline manager would be far too naive!
So what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
Quote from: kaysixteen on August 04, 2023, 09:45:37 AMSo what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
??? People complain a lot ??? Note that in this context the kids are paying customers too.
But for the lifehack portion of the event, the DOT has a dashboard (https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/airline-customer-service-dashboard) that people can use to see which airlines have a process to guarantee seating children under 13 with a parent at no extra charge (but note if the flight get delayed, reassigned to a different size plane, or there aren't available adjacent seats at the time of reservation, or adjacent seating is not possible based on seating layout, they don't have to)
Quote from: kaysixteen on August 04, 2023, 09:45:37 AMSo what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
Upgrade, young [wo]man, upgrade! :-)
Quote from: kaysixteen on August 04, 2023, 09:45:37 AMSo what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
Same thing as when kiddoes sitting next to the parent start acting up and annoying people sitting around them: nothing happens (E.G. I was kept up all night on a trans-Pacific red eye flight by a screaming toddler who was sitting next to his parents.) Nobody does anything. What can you do, honestly.
Quote from: lightning on August 04, 2023, 01:54:14 PMQuote from: kaysixteen on August 04, 2023, 09:45:37 AMSo what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
Same thing as when kiddoes sitting next to the parent start acting up and annoying people sitting around them: nothing happens (E.G. I was kept up all night on a trans-Pacific red eye flight by a screaming toddler who was sitting next to his parents.) Nobody does anything. What can you do, honestly.
I mean... I was on a flight not long ago behind some parents who told their four year-old to shut up a bunch of times and just ignored him while he screamed for three hours. Eventually the flight attendant suggested maybe holding him and walking up and down the aisle a bit. It fixed the problem immediately.
I suspect, though I have no other evidence, that they were of the sleep-training mindset that they can't acknowledge or comfort the feeling at all because the kid has to suck it up, and any comfort just sets him back. That's total bullshit, of course, and the evidence indicates it's entirely wrong. But so it goes.
I just can't imagine blithely ignoring the hatchling like that. Even if I can't successfully comfort him, of course I'll be
trying to. Who the fuck wouldn't? The mind boggles.
Quote from: kaysixteen on August 04, 2023, 09:45:37 AMSo what happens on one of those flights when kiddoes seated apart from parents acts up, annoys paying customers, etc?
Not seating young children with their parents is batshit crazy.
Yup, it's batshit crazy alright, but even if Scrooge Airways is doing this, parents have to suck it up and pay the premium class rate to get a guaranteed seat next to junior. There really is a diff between kiddoes acting up whilst sitting next to mummsie, vs one acting out perhaps rows away from her. IOW, in the latter case, the unattended child may well do very unacceptable things that mummsie would stop if she were sitting next to him, such as hit, kick, touch the 90yo next to him, etc. No go, and there has to be some way for flight attendants to do somethng about this.
Ok, I am a proponent of not taking the chance that your kid will be seated away from you, and even provided a mechanism to ID airlines where it won't happen. But I also want to push back a bit on the idea that children on planes are always disruptive etc. and that's somehow their parent's fault. By far I have been more bothered by other adults who watch things on their computer without headphones, stick their (occasionally bare) feet on the back of my arm rest, try to take over my armrest or footwell, wear extreme amounts of perfume, pull on the back of my seat for no apparent reason etc. As long as parents are making a game effort to soothe their kid, I'm not going to think anything negative about them. Adults should generally be able to condider others and control their own behavior. Children sometimes can't, and it's just mean to blame that on parents on a plane who don't have access to the best method of calming kids down (removing them from the environment).
My pre-academic job required a lot of travel and I have lifetime status with a particular airline so have a lot of experience flying. It may be a 'hack' to make travel cheaper for families but I have, on several occasions, refused to give up my paid-for seat for someone who could not be bothered to book seats that allowed them to sit with their children. It's really quite inconsiderate of them to ask. The few times I have moved, it's only been to a better seat. I've been seated by both annoying children and annoying adults on planes, have told manspreading men to get their legs out of my space, 'accidentally' dumped ice water on feet that were on my armrest, and tried unsuccessfully to sleep on a long-haul flight with a screaming infant behind me (actually felt bad for the parents, they were trying their best). Annoyances have always been part of air travel, but someone trying to save a few pennies should not inconvenience other passengers. It's just plain rude.
It just seems that children seated away from their parents is a tantrum/freakout waiting to happen.
Quote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 08:06:48 AMMy pre-academic job required a lot of travel and I have lifetime status with a particular airline so have a lot of experience flying. It may be a 'hack' to make travel cheaper for families but I have, on several occasions, refused to give up my paid-for seat for someone who could not be bothered to book seats that allowed them to sit with their children. It's really quite inconsiderate of them to ask. The few times I have moved, it's only been to a better seat. I've been seated by both annoying children and annoying adults on planes, have told manspreading men to get their legs out of my space, 'accidentally' dumped ice water on feet that were on my armrest, and tried unsuccessfully to sleep on a long-haul flight with a screaming infant behind me (actually felt bad for the parents, they were trying their best). Annoyances have always been part of air travel, but someone trying to save a few pennies should not inconvenience other passengers. It's just plain rude.
I should be clearer about something, and I should have specified this detail earlier: I never once asked anyone to switch seats. That's Bull$hlt. It was the airlines themselves (without me asking) that seat-assigned Lightning children together with me, at check-in.
It seems that I am either really lucky, or I'm really, really lucky.
Also, I should add that I did this "travel hack" starting in the the Lightning childrens' tween years. I generally avoided travel on planes with them, when they were younger than the tween years. Traveling with very young children, in general, is a PITA, whether by plane, car, or train, so I just tried to avoid travel with them altogether, until they were older. (For example, Lightning childrens' grandparents had to come visit us during the holidays--not the other way around.)
Quote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 08:06:48 AMMy pre-academic job required a lot of travel and I have lifetime status with a particular airline so have a lot of experience flying. It may be a 'hack' to make travel cheaper for families but I have, on several occasions, refused to give up my paid-for seat for someone who could not be bothered to book seats that allowed them to sit with their children. It's really quite inconsiderate of them to ask. The few times I have moved, it's only been to a better seat. I've been seated by both annoying children and annoying adults on planes, have told manspreading men to get their legs out of my space, 'accidentally' dumped ice water on feet that were on my armrest, and tried unsuccessfully to sleep on a long-haul flight with a screaming infant behind me (actually felt bad for the parents, they were trying their best). Annoyances have always been part of air travel, but someone trying to save a few pennies should not inconvenience other passengers. It's just plain rude.
When I fly alone (or with other adults) I always give up my seat to someone who's looking. I think it makes everyone's life easier. And let's be honest: I'm not flying first class, so the comfort difference between the seats is marginal at best.
I'm puzzled that you'd be both so unhappy to be sitting next to an unaccompanied child, but also so invested in punishing the child and the parents that you wouldn't trade seats with one of the parents. I mean, isn't that by definition a move to a better seat for you? Why make yourself miserable to make them miserable, when you could all come out of it happier?
Quote from: Parasaurolophus on August 05, 2023, 09:55:45 AMQuote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 08:06:48 AMMy pre-academic job required a lot of travel and I have lifetime status with a particular airline so have a lot of experience flying. It may be a 'hack' to make travel cheaper for families but I have, on several occasions, refused to give up my paid-for seat for someone who could not be bothered to book seats that allowed them to sit with their children. It's really quite inconsiderate of them to ask. The few times I have moved, it's only been to a better seat. I've been seated by both annoying children and annoying adults on planes, have told manspreading men to get their legs out of my space, 'accidentally' dumped ice water on feet that were on my armrest, and tried unsuccessfully to sleep on a long-haul flight with a screaming infant behind me (actually felt bad for the parents, they were trying their best). Annoyances have always been part of air travel, but someone trying to save a few pennies should not inconvenience other passengers. It's just plain rude.
When I fly alone (or with other adults) I always give up my seat to someone who's looking. I think it makes everyone's life easier. And let's be honest: I'm not flying first class, so the comfort difference between the seats is marginal at best.
I'm puzzled that you'd be both so unhappy to be sitting next to an unaccompanied child, but also so invested in punishing the child and the parents that you wouldn't trade seats with one of the parents. I mean, isn't that by definition a move to a better seat for you? Why make yourself miserable to make them miserable, when you could all come out of it happier?
I didn't say I was particularly unhappy, definitely not miserable, to sit by an unaccompanied child. I did say I'd been seated by annoying people, both children and adults, because that's all a part of air travel. I don't see me not wanting to move as punishing a child, perhaps it's punishing their parent for poor choices. The times I've been asked to move and I didn't, if I recall correctly, it was to a middle seat, no thanks, or from a seat with extra legroom to one further back that didn't have it, definitely not going to do that. I like my window seats with people on one side only, and seats that have enough legroom to be marginally comfortable because I'm tall. I still hold that parents who won't pay up front for seats by their children, and expect others to accommodate them, are selfish and cheap. And when I have flown with others, including children, I/we paid to make sure we were all seated together, and if the flight could not accommodate that, I/we did not ask other passengers to switch, nor did I/we ask the airline to switch things for us.
Quote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 10:24:40 AMI don't see me not wanting to move as punishing a child, perhaps it's punishing their parent for poor choices. T
Hmm. I guess it seems to me like not being seated with at least one parent is harder on the four year-old than the parents. But mine's only two, so maybe I'm wrong about that.
Quote from: ciao_yall on August 05, 2023, 08:35:04 AMIt just seems that children seated away from their parents is a tantrum/freakout waiting to happen.
You might be surprised then by how many parents book tickets for themselves in business/first and put their kids back in coach (not tiny children, but 10+). The kids aren't freaking out, they're kicking seats, spilling drinks, pestering the FAs every 2 minutes for another coke, watching all their videos on high volume without headphones, etc.
And they're not "unaccompanied minors" so they don't get that treatment either: their parents are on the plane, just blissfully out of earshot.
Quote from: bacardiandlime on August 08, 2023, 04:04:18 AMQuote from: ciao_yall on August 05, 2023, 08:35:04 AMIt just seems that children seated away from their parents is a tantrum/freakout waiting to happen.
You might be surprised then by how many parents book tickets for themselves in business/first and put their kids back in coach (not tiny children, but 10+). The kids aren't freaking out, they're kicking seats, spilling drinks, pestering the FAs every 2 minutes for another coke, watching all their videos on high volume without headphones, etc.
And they're not "unaccompanied minors" so they don't get that treatment either: their parents are on the plane, just blissfully out of earshot.
So they're effectively using the flight attendants as babysitters? That's not cool. It sounds a bit like the problem libraries had before smart phones became universal. Parents would come to the library and spend hours on social media on library computers, while the children ran around unattended.
Random observations and questions:
1) If mummsie and daddie decide to park the kiddoes in coach whilst living it up in first class, and the kiddoes behave poorly during the flight, methinks the lead FA should order that one of the parents give up their first class seat and trade it with an aggrieved involuntary coach neighbor of the kiddoes. Both parents if necessary. What would induce the airlines to allow paying adult customers to be bothered by naughty children, in such instances?
2) Related to this, does anyone here who would be old enough to have flown as an adult say, 50 years ago, to note how different things in this respect were on US airline flights back then?
3) WRT apl's exposure to adults who occupy themselves with library computers or other things, allowing their children to rumpus about, bothering patrons, etc., is not the appropriate solution to tell parents to take their children and decamp?
Quote from: kaysixteen on August 09, 2023, 08:47:48 PMRandom observations and questions:
1) If mummsie and daddie decide to park the kiddoes in coach whilst living it up in first class, and the kiddoes behave poorly during the flight, methinks the lead FA should order that one of the parents give up their first class seat and trade it with an aggrieved involuntary coach neighbor of the kiddoes. Both parents if necessary. What would induce the airlines to allow paying adult customers to be bothered by naughty children, in such instances?
2) Related to this, does anyone here who would be old enough to have flown as an adult say, 50 years ago, to note how different things in this respect were on US airline flights back then?
3) WRT apl's exposure to adults who occupy themselves with library computers or other things, allowing their children to rumpus about, bothering patrons, etc., is not the appropriate solution to tell parents to take their children and decamp?
Hell, fifty years ago, we dressed up to fly! I even wore a tie.
As for the rest, all this is a standard externality -- spillover -- problem. The way to think about it is: Who owns the aircraft space, those who let their kids run loose, or those who want peace and quiet? From the point of view of the airline, the question is: Who will pay more, those who let their kids loose, or those who want peace and quiet?
From what I've learned from this thread, it's those who want peace and quiet who are willing to pay more. The airlines have learned this and charge accordingly.
The consequence of legislating or regulating peace and quiet standards would be to make it more expensive for those least willing to pay. Many of those people would then use cars or trains to travel rather than planes. But cars and even trains are less safe than planes! Thus, such regulations would cause more premature deaths!
Another way of dealing with externalities is self restraint, culture, though I hesitate to use the word. A norm -- everybody restrains their kids -- would make life easier for many, but not all. That self-restraint has disappeared, and I know of no way to bring it back.
Grin and bear it or pay more.
Quote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 10:24:40 AMQuote from: Parasaurolophus on August 05, 2023, 09:55:45 AMQuote from: EdnaMode on August 05, 2023, 08:06:48 AMMy pre-academic job required a lot of travel and I have lifetime status with a particular airline so have a lot of experience flying. It may be a 'hack' to make travel cheaper for families but I have, on several occasions, refused to give up my paid-for seat for someone who could not be bothered to book seats that allowed them to sit with their children. It's really quite inconsiderate of them to ask. The few times I have moved, it's only been to a better seat. I've been seated by both annoying children and annoying adults on planes, have told manspreading men to get their legs out of my space, 'accidentally' dumped ice water on feet that were on my armrest, and tried unsuccessfully to sleep on a long-haul flight with a screaming infant behind me (actually felt bad for the parents, they were trying their best). Annoyances have always been part of air travel, but someone trying to save a few pennies should not inconvenience other passengers. It's just plain rude.
When I fly alone (or with other adults) I always give up my seat to someone who's looking. I think it makes everyone's life easier. And let's be honest: I'm not flying first class, so the comfort difference between the seats is marginal at best.
I'm puzzled that you'd be both so unhappy to be sitting next to an unaccompanied child, but also so invested in punishing the child and the parents that you wouldn't trade seats with one of the parents. I mean, isn't that by definition a move to a better seat for you? Why make yourself miserable to make them miserable, when you could all come out of it happier?
I didn't say I was particularly unhappy, definitely not miserable, to sit by an unaccompanied child. I did say I'd been seated by annoying people, both children and adults, because that's all a part of air travel. I don't see me not wanting to move as punishing a child, perhaps it's punishing their parent for poor choices. The times I've been asked to move and I didn't, if I recall correctly, it was to a middle seat, no thanks, or from a seat with extra legroom to one further back that didn't have it, definitely not going to do that. I like my window seats with people on one side only, and seats that have enough legroom to be marginally comfortable because I'm tall. I still hold that parents who won't pay up front for seats by their children, and expect others to accommodate them, are selfish and cheap. And when I have flown with others, including children, I/we paid to make sure we were all seated together, and if the flight could not accommodate that, I/we did not ask other passengers to switch, nor did I/we ask the airline to switch things for us.
Shouldn't it almost always be possible to be asking someone to switch from a similar seat. Not the same situation but I was on a flight with wife, baby and 6 year old the other day and for whatever reason there weren't seats available all together and I was one row up in the aisle and they were the middle and window behind me. It actually turned out that nobody was in the seat next to them, but if somebody was, I was going to see if they would switch with me, which I assume they would have been happy to do since they'd probably prefer the aisle seat not next to a baby.
Shouldn't you pretty much always be able to switch in a way that is acceptable? I guess if other people are sitting together that might be a problem, but most of the time there should be someone who either can get the same seat with no child or a seat they might actually prefer? At any rate, I've never been asked to switch to a seat that was worse for me.
Quote from: Caracal on August 11, 2023, 05:46:32 AMShouldn't it almost always be possible to be asking someone to switch from a similar seat.
Nope, because if you book basic economy tickets they are almost always going to be middle seats- so if you and kid(s) all have middle seats, there is no way to ask people to move in a way that lets you sit together without someone giving up a window or aisle seat for a middle seat. As someone who pays extra to have a window seat, sorry, but I'm not going to rectify the poor decision of parents to book basic economy by giving it up for a middle seat.
Quote from: Puget on August 11, 2023, 07:28:05 AMNope, because if you book basic economy tickets they are almost always going to be middle seats- so if you and kid(s) all have middle seats, there is no way to ask people to move in a way that lets you sit together without someone giving up a window or aisle seat for a middle seat.
Not to mention that as a regular flyer, one encounters parents who seem to use this as a TACTIC. Book the cheapest seat option, then attempt to guilt strangers into giving up their (better) seats because "we're a family and we want to sit together".
I would not want my child seated next to strangers. What if the person next to your child were a creep? Would the child have the guts/sense to call the attendant, make a scene, etc.? What if the person pumped the child for information on the family? Would you want that? I can't believe that a responsible parent would take a risk like that just to save a few bucks.
Then there are all the other reasons detailed by others in postings above.
Quote from: cathwen on August 12, 2023, 06:45:32 AMI would not want my child seated next to strangers.
And airlines are super alert to this with unaccompanied minors. As a frequent flyer woman (ie someone the airline knows a lot about), traveling alone, I would often be seated beside an unaccompanied minor - and I understood why.
So, we flew home yesterday. I paid for us to be seated together.
We were seated apart.
I asked a stranger to move (from a windowless window seat to the aisle), and she readily agreed. But just FYI, sometimes you pay to be seated together but aren't.
Quote from: Parasaurolophus on August 21, 2023, 06:30:44 AMSo, we flew home yesterday. I paid for us to be seated together.
We were seated apart.
I asked a stranger to move (from a windowless window seat to the aisle), and she readily agreed. But just FYI, sometimes you pay to be seated together but aren't.
you should ask for a refund of the premium that you paid to have seating choice
Quote from: lightning on August 21, 2023, 02:34:36 PMQuote from: Parasaurolophus on August 21, 2023, 06:30:44 AMSo, we flew home yesterday. I paid for us to be seated together.
We were seated apart.
I asked a stranger to move (from a windowless window seat to the aisle), and she readily agreed. But just FYI, sometimes you pay to be seated together but aren't.
you should ask for a refund of the premium that you paid to have seating choice
I shall. And I shall wait a couple years to receive it, I'm sure.
But, y'know. Just a cautionary note for the punishers out there. I'd also observe that one can still be seated with one's family if one checks in relatively early, so it's really not all that deplorable a situation for people to find themselves in.