How do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
Also, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions? For example, they do not have time to do their work because they have to work, athletics, etc.. and they tell you that they like the way another professor teaches their class and they wish you did it that way.
Take charge.
Marginalize the eye-rolling student. Best bet is to ignore them. But if you feel that you must engage, then cold call on them with a difficult question and let them stumble over trying to answer it for an uncomfortably long time. If you really want to make your point, make it clear that you think their answer was the dumbest thing you've ever heard.
Tell the athlete, or whoever, that managing their time is their responsibility, not yours, and that they can drop the class if they don't like your teaching style. Give them zeros for the missing work.
Students will walk all over you if you let them.
What Sun Worshiper posted.
I've never had an eye-roller, but I have had various other distractors and jerkwads.
I call on them. Look for the eye-roll. Then put them on the spot. Do it as sweetly as you can as if you are simply asking them an honest question or prompt. Give them your full attention when you do this. Usually, like most bullies, the jerk will fold. I've shut down lots of talkers and sleepers this way.
On the other hand, the students think the eye-roller is the jerk, not you. So, who cares? As long as the other students are into your class, let eyeballs hang themselves. Ignoring them might actually work too.
Sorry you have to deal with this.
Thank you for the responses and it is a pain in my............... I am going to take the advice and give it a try!
Before you implement any of these ideas, think through how *you* interact with your students. Classroom management depends very much on your personality. You cannot always implement that which works well for someone else. Your other students will be watching how you interact with this disrespectful student. If they perceive that you are "picking on" him/her, that may destroy the rapport you have with the rest of the class. Once gone, it is very very difficult to build back that rapport.
If it is only a handful of students who are looking to this disrespectful student for cues, I would just ignore the student and focus your attention to those who are in the classroom to learn.
The other students may be looking at the eye-roller not to see if the eye-roller approves, but just because the eye-rollers responses are so over-the-top.
Quote from: arcturus on October 28, 2023, 05:06:11 PMBefore you implement any of these ideas, think through how *you* interact with your students. Classroom management depends very much on your personality. You cannot always implement that which works well for someone else. Your other students will be watching how you interact with this disrespectful student. If they perceive that you are "picking on" him/her, that may destroy the rapport you have with the rest of the class. Once gone, it is very very difficult to build back that rapport.
If it is only a handful of students who are looking to this disrespectful student for cues, I would just ignore the student and focus your attention to those who are in the classroom to learn.
Good point
Quote from: Hegemony on October 28, 2023, 05:23:21 PMThe other students may be looking at the eye-roller not to see if the eye-roller approves, but just because the eye-rollers responses are so over-the-top.
Good point, I do not think it is that the eye roller approves. I think it is because the eye roller thinks he knows everything if that makes sense.
I would nip this one in the bud immediately. There are probably several pissed-off students who might be seething at the disruptions and wondering why the instructor is allowing these to continue. I've on occasion emailed students to let them know that the classroom is a professional environment, that they are expected to conduct themselves as such, and that these disruptions are interfering with the ability of the other students to benefit from the course. You could also add a sentence inviting the student to come to your office hours to discuss their concerns. If your syllabus doesn't have any information about classroom protocols, you could spend about 10 minutes discussing these, the expectations of students attending classes to have a disruption-free environment, and also if you like, a sentence or two about email protocols. Several websites have the relevant information and the wording you would need to use. As for the "poor me" students, refer them to the syllabus. What does your syllabus say about late or missed assignments? I would also suggest asking a trusted colleague to see how you come across to your students.
One of my favorite things to say after asking a question, "Stu, you're making a face. What do you think of X?" Sometimes this is an eyeroll, sometimes a grimace, or a hundred other things. I've found that my students express themselves facially when they're not willing (for whatever reason) to raise their hand or comment. I don't comment on the facial expressions themselves; in other words, I don't assume an eyeroll is dismissive of me or my comments etc. Usually they then jump at the chance to say what's on their minds, because by calling on them I've relieved them of the anxiety of volunteering.
Quote from: RatGuy on October 30, 2023, 05:44:11 AMOne of my favorite things to say after asking a question, "Stu, you're making a face. What do you think of X?" Sometimes this is an eyeroll, sometimes a grimace, or a hundred other things. I've found that my students express themselves facially when they're not willing (for whatever reason) to raise their hand or comment. I don't comment on the facial expressions themselves; in other words, I don't assume an eyeroll is dismissive of me or my comments etc. Usually they then jump at the chance to say what's on their minds, because by calling on them I've relieved them of the anxiety of volunteering.
Yeah, if I ask "do you think the writer is telling the truth here" and somebody shakes their head and grimaces, I take that as an opening. "John, you're making a face, you don't think we should trust him on this?"
I'm not in the class, but I agree that you want to be careful about assuming the student is trying to be disruptive. Are you sure it isn't a tick? Students can also just be really unaware of their body language. This seems weird to adults, but that's because appropriate body language is one of the things you learn quite quickly in a professional setting. Grad school is where I learned to look interested and thoughtful when I was really just thinking about what a doofus I thought the presenter was, or what I was going to eat for dinner.
Quote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
Also, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions? For example, they do not have time to do their work because they have to work, athletics, etc.. and they tell you that they like the way another professor teaches their class and they wish you did it that way.
For the "I don't have time to do the work for this class" students, I'd sympathize with them being busy & direct them to resources on campus (the advisor, financial aid, etc.). Athletes are often very good students because they have to maintain high grades to stay on the team.
For the "I wish you taught like other prof", I wish I had good advice other than to not let it bother you. Maybe "other prof" gives out As like candy/is an amazing story teller/teaches a really fun subject. Who knows. Don't waste brain space worrying about it.
Quote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
I am having trouble understanding what the issue is. How many students are there in the class? Assuming that it is not a giant lecture hall (in which case, who cares) and it is not a small seminar course (in which this could be really disruptive), it sounds like you have an annoying and rude student in a midsize class. It is possible the student does not realize that what they are doing is either really rude or that you notice. If you think this is the case, you could either react in class (Joe--You seem to disagree with what I am saying. Could you explain?) or talk to the student after class and tell them you wish they would act differently.
If you think that the student is doing it on purpose, i.e., is trying to upset you or challenge you, then you need to decide whether you want to escalate it or ignore it. If you want to escalate it, I would suggest calling on the student as if they had said something. Every time they roll their eyes, you can treat it as if they made a verbal comment and ask them to elaborate or explain. Of course you have to decide if you want to hand this student the megaphone.
But more generally, I think that there are certain rules: come to class and do not disrupt, do not talk during lecture, etc. It is rude to be rude, but you have to decide if it is worth it to call out every student every time they roll their eyes, stop paying attention, check their phone, etc.
Quote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMAlso, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions? For example, they do not have time to do their work because they have to work, athletics, etc.. and they tell you that they like the way another professor teaches their class and they wish you did it that way.
Students are often overextended and do not have time to do school work. You need to have a general policy. You can be hard (it is due on X date/time and I will not accept it later) or soft (accept work late, with or without a penalty, up to a certain time). Personally I don't let my emotions get involved, and I do not take it personally that somebody doesn't turn in the work. It is probably not a personal insult.
The only time emotions come into play is when a student makes a case for something terrible happening to them justifies turning in something late. I've had horrible stories--deaths, illnesses, etc. I am generally flexible--and may allow a student to turn in something late because their whole family dies, or because they have a head cold. I don't try to evaluate. If something is really bad I usually advise to talk to the dean of students. I had a student once who was in an abusive relationship, was seeking a divorce, and was involved in some type of custody support, and got in a car accident on the way to divorce court. They missed two months of class. I told them I was very sorry, that probably they should focus on getting their various issues resolved before worrying about the course, and that they should talk to the dean of students about withdrawing from the course and the counseling center about their issues. My point is that it was a genuine emotional issue, but even so, there are limits to what I can do.
If a student says the prefer something another professor does, I usually ask them what they like, and tell them I will consider it for next semester. I sometimes do include things that other professors do, but I try not to switch horses in midstream.
I guess that my bottom line, in response to both questions is, try not to take all of this too personally. Treat your students with humanity and respect; hopefully this will result in their treating you the same way, but even if not, it is not worth it to get angry at most students.
I think the most important thing is not to assume any of this is personal. I know it feels personal, but students rarely think about us when they are making decisions or facial expressions.
Quote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMAlso, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions?.
Of all the transformation I've seen in a quarter-century of teaching, this is the one that gets me the most. We all have the duty to be flexible, but I'm finding that appeals to issues that are not clearly acute in any way (e.g. car trouble, "I've got a lot on my plate," took the wrong bus, etc.) are being employed by the same subset of students as part of pleas for indefinite flexibility on everything from attendance to due dates. Each new week brings with it more of these types of excuses. Everything should apparently be negotiable in intro classes with scores of students.
As for referring students to campus resources helping with everything from counseling to food insecurity, forget it. Most of my students aren't interested, and simply want to deal with their stated issues in terms of out-of-class makeup assignments and extensions. As for administrators, forget it: they don't want to stick their necks out giving advice and specialize in winking with messages that are endless variants of "work with these students."
Quote from: Zeus Bird on October 31, 2023, 11:03:27 AMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMAlso, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions?.
Of all the transformation I've seen in a quarter-century of teaching, this is the one that gets me the most. We all have the duty to be flexible, but I'm finding that appeals to issues that are not clearly acute in any way (e.g. car trouble, "I've got a lot on my plate," took the wrong bus, etc.) are being employed by the same subset of students as part of pleas for indefinite flexibility on everything from attendance to due dates. Each new week brings with it more of these types of excuses. Everything should apparently be negotiable in intro classes with scores of students.
As for referring students to campus resources helping with everything from counseling to food insecurity, forget it. Most of my students aren't interested, and simply want to deal with their stated issues in terms of out-of-class makeup assignments and extensions. As for administrators, forget it: they don't want to stick their necks out giving advice and specialize in winking with messages that are endless variants of "work with these students."
Agreed.
Perhaps this is an unpopular opinion these days, but being endlessly flexible to accommodate students is not doing them any favors. Yes, there are extenuating circumstances, but a lot of things that students want latitude on would not fly in the workplace.
I have taking to saying frequently "The semester is a finite period of time." Endless extensions are not actually possible, and are almost always bad ideas that lead to snowballing issues.
Quote from: Sun_Worshiper on October 31, 2023, 11:11:36 AMQuote from: Zeus Bird on October 31, 2023, 11:03:27 AMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMAlso, how do you deal with students who play on your emotions?.
Of all the transformation I've seen in a quarter-century of teaching, this is the one that gets me the most. We all have the duty to be flexible, but I'm finding that appeals to issues that are not clearly acute in any way (e.g. car trouble, "I've got a lot on my plate," took the wrong bus, etc.) are being employed by the same subset of students as part of pleas for indefinite flexibility on everything from attendance to due dates. Each new week brings with it more of these types of excuses. Everything should apparently be negotiable in intro classes with scores of students.
As for referring students to campus resources helping with everything from counseling to food insecurity, forget it. Most of my students aren't interested, and simply want to deal with their stated issues in terms of out-of-class makeup assignments and extensions. As for administrators, forget it: they don't want to stick their necks out giving advice and specialize in winking with messages that are endless variants of "work with these students."
Agreed.
Perhaps this is an unpopular opinion these days, but being endlessly flexible to accommodate students is not doing them any favors. Yes, there are extenuating circumstances, but a lot of things that students want latitude on would not fly in the workplace.
My school basically wants us to be endlessly flexible with students, but I don't think that sets a good policy (plus it often causes students to try to do the entire course in the last week, which doesn't end well for them, and which the college also doesn't like and the college also blames me for). So I ask for some sort of documentation, whether it's a positive COVID test next to their ID or some sort of receipt/doctor's note/police report/etc. I do allow work late, up to the end of the semester (with a 50% penalty after five days late) and I drop lowest whatevers, so I think it's fair.
My asynchronous online, large enrollment, GenEd STEM class has a lot of low-stakes assignments. I do not allow late work and I do not drop lowest scores (in part because the only way students will learn anything in this class is to do the assignments, since they do not choose to read the book or watch the videos...). My rationale for not allowing late work is that such policies can cause students to spiral. In particular, if they were not able to do the work in my class due to event [X], they are probably also behind in their other classes too. Trying to do this week's work plus last week's work, plus still deal with whatever continuing fall-out from event [X] remains, is often a recipe for falling even further behind. By not allowing late work, my students can put their efforts into their other classes (which they care about more than mine, in any event) and into regaining control of the other aspects of their lives.
Quote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
OP's concern was about this specific behaviour which is inconsistent with a tic or some sort of mannerism. Stu is clearly creating an environment that is not conducive to learning. OP, how do the other students respond to Stu? Students in my evening classes would find such behavior to be disruptive and expect the instructor to handle the situation. Here, in the city, we have students who work during the day, and then take courses in the evening or weekends, and who would not tolerate disruptions. I've had students who worked in construction, in stores, as nannies, and also students who have had to arrange for childcare so that they could come to class. They deserve an environment where they are not distracted by an obviously bored student.
Quote from: Langue_doc on October 31, 2023, 01:52:13 PMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
OP's concern was about this specific behaviour which is inconsistent with a tic or some sort of mannerism. Stu is clearly creating an environment that is not conducive to learning. OP, how do the other students respond to Stu? Students in my evening classes would find such behavior to be disruptive and expect the instructor to handle the situation. Here, in the city, we have students who work during the day, and then take courses in the evening or weekends, and who would not tolerate disruptions. I've had students who worked in construction, in stores, as nannies, and also students who have had to arrange for childcare so that they could come to class. They deserve an environment where they are not distracted by an obviously bored student.
When I first started teaching I had a student who was disruptive in a somewhat similar way to OP's situation. This went on for several weeks. One day, I got fed up and said something to the effect of "anyone in this class who doesn't read or pay attention, acts disruptively, and compromises the learning environment, should just stay home, because I don't want them here." As soon as I said it, I could see that the other students in the class were relieved and I realized that they were on my side. From there, the classroom vibe changed for the better.
OP, you are an authority figure in this situation. If there is a problem that is making it difficult for students to learn then you need to take charge and handle it. You can do it in various ways (ignore the student, challenge them in front of the class, take them aside and ask them to tone it down, etc.), but if a student is being purposefully disruptive then you need to take steps to stop them.
Quote from: Sun_Worshiper on October 31, 2023, 04:59:59 PMQuote from: Langue_doc on October 31, 2023, 01:52:13 PMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
OP's concern was about this specific behaviour which is inconsistent with a tic or some sort of mannerism. Stu is clearly creating an environment that is not conducive to learning. OP, how do the other students respond to Stu? Students in my evening classes would find such behavior to be disruptive and expect the instructor to handle the situation. Here, in the city, we have students who work during the day, and then take courses in the evening or weekends, and who would not tolerate disruptions. I've had students who worked in construction, in stores, as nannies, and also students who have had to arrange for childcare so that they could come to class. They deserve an environment where they are not distracted by an obviously bored student.
When I first started teaching I had a student who was disruptive in a somewhat similar way to OP's situation. This went on for several weeks. One day, I got fed up and said something to the effect of "anyone in this class who doesn't read or pay attention, acts disruptively, and compromises the learning environment, should just stay home, because I don't want them here." As soon as I said it, I could see that the other students in the class were relieved and I realized that they were on my side. From there, the classroom vibe changed for the better.
OP, you are an authority figure in this situation. If there is a problem that is making it difficult for students to learn then you need to take charge and handle it. You can do it in various ways (ignore the student, challenge them in front of the class, take them aside and ask them to tone it down, etc.), but if a student is being purposefully disruptive then you need to take steps to stop them.
For what it's worth, my first few years teaching, I had some issues with students who seemed to be trying to challenge or undermine me in class and it really hasn't been a problem since. I suspect it's just that as I became more comfortable and confident as a teacher, students stopped feeling like I was open to direct challenges. I didn't become an authoritarian or anything, I think I just fill the space in the classroom in a way that doesn't give students the impression they can try to take over.
Quote from: Caracal on November 01, 2023, 07:28:35 AMQuote from: Sun_Worshiper on October 31, 2023, 04:59:59 PMQuote from: Langue_doc on October 31, 2023, 01:52:13 PMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
OP's concern was about this specific behaviour which is inconsistent with a tic or some sort of mannerism. Stu is clearly creating an environment that is not conducive to learning. OP, how do the other students respond to Stu? Students in my evening classes would find such behavior to be disruptive and expect the instructor to handle the situation. Here, in the city, we have students who work during the day, and then take courses in the evening or weekends, and who would not tolerate disruptions. I've had students who worked in construction, in stores, as nannies, and also students who have had to arrange for childcare so that they could come to class. They deserve an environment where they are not distracted by an obviously bored student.
When I first started teaching I had a student who was disruptive in a somewhat similar way to OP's situation. This went on for several weeks. One day, I got fed up and said something to the effect of "anyone in this class who doesn't read or pay attention, acts disruptively, and compromises the learning environment, should just stay home, because I don't want them here." As soon as I said it, I could see that the other students in the class were relieved and I realized that they were on my side. From there, the classroom vibe changed for the better.
OP, you are an authority figure in this situation. If there is a problem that is making it difficult for students to learn then you need to take charge and handle it. You can do it in various ways (ignore the student, challenge them in front of the class, take them aside and ask them to tone it down, etc.), but if a student is being purposefully disruptive then you need to take steps to stop them.
For what it's worth, my first few years teaching, I had some issues with students who seemed to be trying to challenge or undermine me in class and it really hasn't been a problem since. I suspect it's just that as I became more comfortable and confident as a teacher, students stopped feeling like I was open to direct challenges. I didn't become an authoritarian or anything, I think I just fill the space in the classroom in a way that doesn't give students the impression they can try to take over.
I agree that as one becomes more comfortable and seasoned there is less of this kind of thing. But sometimes a professor has to take charge and exercise their authority for everyone's sake.
Quote from: Sun_Worshiper on November 01, 2023, 07:58:43 AMQuote from: Caracal on November 01, 2023, 07:28:35 AMQuote from: Sun_Worshiper on October 31, 2023, 04:59:59 PMQuote from: Langue_doc on October 31, 2023, 01:52:13 PMQuote from: HigherEd7 on October 28, 2023, 09:08:01 AMHow do you deal with a student in your class who constantly rolls their eyes every time you say something and then looks around at the other students in class? This has been a distraction to me because I have noticed students will look at this student when I say something to see if this student approves.
OP's concern was about this specific behaviour which is inconsistent with a tic or some sort of mannerism. Stu is clearly creating an environment that is not conducive to learning. OP, how do the other students respond to Stu? Students in my evening classes would find such behavior to be disruptive and expect the instructor to handle the situation. Here, in the city, we have students who work during the day, and then take courses in the evening or weekends, and who would not tolerate disruptions. I've had students who worked in construction, in stores, as nannies, and also students who have had to arrange for childcare so that they could come to class. They deserve an environment where they are not distracted by an obviously bored student.
When I first started teaching I had a student who was disruptive in a somewhat similar way to OP's situation. This went on for several weeks. One day, I got fed up and said something to the effect of "anyone in this class who doesn't read or pay attention, acts disruptively, and compromises the learning environment, should just stay home, because I don't want them here." As soon as I said it, I could see that the other students in the class were relieved and I realized that they were on my side. From there, the classroom vibe changed for the better.
OP, you are an authority figure in this situation. If there is a problem that is making it difficult for students to learn then you need to take charge and handle it. You can do it in various ways (ignore the student, challenge them in front of the class, take them aside and ask them to tone it down, etc.), but if a student is being purposefully disruptive then you need to take steps to stop them.
For what it's worth, my first few years teaching, I had some issues with students who seemed to be trying to challenge or undermine me in class and it really hasn't been a problem since. I suspect it's just that as I became more comfortable and confident as a teacher, students stopped feeling like I was open to direct challenges. I didn't become an authoritarian or anything, I think I just fill the space in the classroom in a way that doesn't give students the impression they can try to take over.
I agree that as one becomes more comfortable and seasoned there is less of this kind of thing. But sometimes a professor has to take charge and exercise their authority for everyone's sake.
This. "Everyone" includes students who are paying tuition, juggling jobs and families, rearranging schedules so that they can come to class, and on occasion also taking care of parents. I've had at least two students, under 20 or 21, having to take on adult responsibilities, either because the student was the only one in the family who spoke and understood English, and in the other instance the student had to get power of attorney to take care of a parent who refused medical attention. Ignoring disruptions does no one any favors, including the one causing the disruptions.