I hope to be in touch with the faculty that peruse this forum so that I can find honest, grounded, open-minded and mature discussion (at least for a good chunk of the discussion, I know this can be a silly matter for some, I'm not scared of y'all having a little fun with this) about a taboo subject. The all famous and easily fallible one, I am compelled towards a professor.
I just want to understand how you, as a professor would interpret the following scenario. My personal intentions are not to harm this person because I know the question I am asking has ramifications that may impact someone other than me. It is not my intention to project my feelings onto anyone, or to ignore the fact that advances to teachers in professional settings can reek havoc, sexual harassment, unfair unwanted sexual attention to a superior, if they reject and I react, basic transference.
I very innocently started to have a crush on my professor three years ago, I did not think much of it, actually I didn't notice it much, bodies are weird. I have kept in touch with her frequently since. To update her about my professional development at school (classes, club stuff).
I know this experience will paint a very skewed picture of how I see her. To add, Before I realized my attraction, I was and still am very keen on getting to know her because of the area of research she specializes in, maybe the attraction motivated extra interest? I was top of her class and I have decided her research specialty is what I will pursue in graduate school.
I desire more than anything to ask her out. I want to take her out and get to know her. I want to know if she could ever see me as anything other than a student. After graduation of course, where she is not pressured and can freely reject me if that's how she feels. For context, I'm 33 years old and she is 40.
I'm curious to know how you would proceed, what you think, how I should handle this, your generally thoughts on professor student dalliances, or generally comments on how silly I am for holding on to this thought for 3 years now :)
Thanks in advance,
An enamored undergrad
Well, assuming this is real...
A professor who asks a current student if they are attracted to them is not behaving appropriately. There's nothing wrong with you having a crush. That happens. There's also nothing wrong with your professor knowing you have a crush on them. However, any sensible person who suspected that a student might have feelings for them would go out of their way to keep the relationship strictly professional. I think you really need to understand this from the perspective of an instructor. There is no world in which I would be asking a student "curious" questions about their sexuality and whether they were attracted to me. The fact that others were around for these discussions doesn't make it any more appropriate, just weirder. At best, this person completely lacks common sense and good judgement. I suspect it is worse than that. Regardless, you really should stay away from them. This isn't likely to end well.
QuoteI'm 33 years old
YIKES.
I thought this was written by a teenager.
Quote from: Caracal on April 20, 2020, 07:07:20 AM
Well, assuming this is real...
A professor who asks a current student if they are attracted to them is not behaving appropriately. There's nothing wrong with you having a crush. That happens. There's also nothing wrong with your professor knowing you have a crush on them. However, any sensible person who suspected that a student might have feelings for them would go out of their way to keep the relationship strictly professional. I think you really need to understand this from the perspective of an instructor. There is no world in which I would be asking a student "curious" questions about their sexuality and whether they were attracted to me. The fact that others were around for these discussions doesn't make it any more appropriate, just weirder. At best, this person completely lacks common sense and good judgement. I suspect it is worse than that. Regardless, you really should stay away from them. This isn't likely to end well.
Yes, this all the way. No matter how much you like your professor, she is the kind of person who acts unprofessionally in a manner that she should absolutely know better than to indulge in. It is not her job to help you realize your sexual orientation. You should reconsider whether such a person is worth your interest.
If, in the end, you decide to pursue this, you yourself would be doing nothing wrong. I think it's unwise (given the reasons above), but you're morally in the clear.
Quote from: Caracal on April 20, 2020, 07:07:20 AM
Well, assuming this is real...
A professor who asks a current student if they are attracted to them is not behaving appropriately. There's nothing wrong with you having a crush. That happens. There's also nothing wrong with your professor knowing you have a crush on them. However, any sensible person who suspected that a student might have feelings for them would go out of their way to keep the relationship strictly professional. I think you really need to understand this from the perspective of an instructor. There is no world in which I would be asking a student "curious" questions about their sexuality and whether they were attracted to me. The fact that others were around for these discussions doesn't make it any more appropriate, just weirder. At best, this person completely lacks common sense and good judgement. I suspect it is worse than that. Regardless, you really should stay away from them. This isn't likely to end well.
^^^This.^^^ A thousand times ^^^This.^^^
Ask around the grapevine and see if you really are a special case or whether the faculty member has a reputation of having a new sweetie from the student ranks every year or so.
Seldom do these romances go well for the students involved, even if the students wait until they are technically no longer students.
Quote from: bacardiandlime on April 20, 2020, 09:12:56 AM
QuoteI'm 33 years old
YIKES.
I thought this was written by a teenager.
LOL. Blindsided by an epic professor, what can I say. You should see her.
Quote from: polly_mer on April 20, 2020, 09:57:43 AM
Ask around the grapevine and see if you really are a special case or whether the faculty member has a reputation of having a new sweetie from the student ranks every year or so.
Seldom do these romances go well for the students involved, even if the students wait until they are technically no longer students.
I'm not sure who I would go to for this. I'm on pretty good terms with grad students in my department, I could potentially ask one, (And I did ask one grad student if it was appropriate for other grad students to ask you if you liked certain professors and TA's, to which she replied, that doesn't seem professional) -- but I think before graduation is risky in case the grad student gets back to the prof. I need letters of reference after all.
I know it might be naive on my part or hormones doing their job but I DO think I'm mature enough to evaluate whether or not I could make the dalliance work. For instance, talking about what happens if we don't end up doing anything long term or keeping a little physical hanky panky secret for instance.
Quote from: ergative on April 20, 2020, 09:25:26 AM
Quote from: Caracal on April 20, 2020, 07:07:20 AM
Well, assuming this is real...
A professor who asks a current student if they are attracted to them is not behaving appropriately. There's nothing wrong with you having a crush. That happens. There's also nothing wrong with your professor knowing you have a crush on them. However, any sensible person who suspected that a student might have feelings for them would go out of their way to keep the relationship strictly professional. I think you really need to understand this from the perspective of an instructor. There is no world in which I would be asking a student "curious" questions about their sexuality and whether they were attracted to me. The fact that others were around for these discussions doesn't make it any more appropriate, just weirder. At best, this person completely lacks common sense and good judgement. I suspect it is worse than that. Regardless, you really should stay away from them. This isn't likely to end well.
Yes, this all the way. No matter how much you like your professor, she is the kind of person who acts unprofessionally in a manner that she should absolutely know better than to indulge in. It is not her job to help you realize your sexual orientation. You should reconsider whether such a person is worth your interest.
If, in the end, you decide to pursue this, you yourself would be doing nothing wrong. I think it's unwise (given the reasons above), but you're morally in the clear.
To be honest, I never really thought about it that way. I think she brought it to light because she does reserach on LGBT people and wanted to offer me a position in her lab. Second, I think she was concerned about my behaviour, maybe I was staring? Maybe I was talking to much to her after class?
You know, I wouldn't put it past male students to harrass a very good looking female professor, maybe she was not comfortable?
Though, I also asked myself many times, why didn't she just leave it? Why'd she ask me? Anyway why did she even bring up sexual orientation before I did? Again, maybe she was just trying to get me to find a personal motivation to be in her lab and talking about sexual orientation stuff might have been her way? But I was asked by multiple people under her supervision if I liked her and honestly the questions were unwanted even if true. My private thoughts are my private thoughts.
I have wondered why people think it's ok to talk about my sexuality or ask about it when I haven't offered first. I did bring this up with her, why was I asked this question in the first place? To which she very stealthily evaded!
Thank you for mentioning it isn't wrong. I have on a number of occasions beaten myself up over liking her.
I get the impression that you're not taking from this something that folks are saying, which is that this kind of remark on her part is not a healthy sign. It is not a sign of good boundaries. You're looking at why she might have said it, and finding various possible reasons. But from the point of view of professionals, she should not have said it, no matter what the reason. It is a sign of overstepping, and that is a very high-risk behavior from someone who unquestionably has heard all the campus controversies about becoming too personal with students. What this means is that if you are graduate and get involved with this professor (which would only be ethical and conscionable after you are no longer a student), she will exercise bad judgment, and therefore would be a bad person to be involved with. I know you may say, "Well, if it's only a fling, it's okay if she's not in tip-top emotional health, it wouldn't be a serious thing between us." But people who have poor judgment can cause havoc at any level of relationship.
I know this is not going to be welcome news to someone with a crush, and there will be all kinds of reasons to dismiss it. But after you've graduated and approached her and things have gone badly, you can recall this and use it for future reference. As the saying is, "The destination is clearly printed on the ticket, so don't be surprised when you end up there." I'm not saying this to be harsh, but to be realistic. It often feels, when we have a crush, as if the intensity of the feeling means that the relationship is "right." But intensity is just intensity; it doesn't signal anything about the other person, it's more about the level of hope and engagement. Go slowly and watch out for yourself.
I'm also going to preface with "assuming that this is real ..."
and just say that you shouldn't do this.
Again, not so much that it shows anything bad about you, other than that you at 33 can't see why this might be a bad idea.
Quote from: Hegemony on April 20, 2020, 02:03:47 PM
I get the impression that you're not taking from this something that folks are saying, which is that this kind of remark on her part is not a healthy sign. It is not a sign of good boundaries. You're looking at why she might have said it, and finding various possible reasons. But from the point of view of professionals, she should not have said it, no matter what the reason. It is a sign of overstepping, and that is a very high-risk behavior from someone who unquestionably has heard all the campus controversies about becoming too personal with students. What this means is that if you are graduate and get involved with this professor (which would only be ethical and conscionable after you are no longer a student), she will exercise bad judgment, and therefore would be a bad person to be involved with. I know you may say, "Well, if it's only a fling, it's okay if she's not in tip-top emotional health, it wouldn't be a serious thing between us." But people who have poor judgment can cause havoc at any level of relationship.
I know this is not going to be welcome news to someone with a crush, and there will be all kinds of reasons to dismiss it. But after you've graduated and approached her and things have gone badly, you can recall this and use it for future reference. As the saying is, "The destination is clearly printed on the ticket, so don't be surprised when you end up there." I'm not saying this to be harsh, but to be realistic. It often feels, when we have a crush, as if the intensity of the feeling means that the relationship is "right." But intensity is just intensity; it doesn't signal anything about the other person, it's more about the level of hope and engagement. Go slowly and watch out for yourself.
I came here for honesty and you're dishing it out. I'm thankful.
I'm trying really hard to have compassion for my professor. I think she got personal with me for a reason that one semester. I think maybe she might have even been worried about my mental health. That wasn't an easy semester for me and I was very greatful to her for being extra kind to me. It's also possible that she gets personal with ALL her students, at least to some degree. I did notice though, that she told me about her sexuality in private and didn't announce it to the class. Again I think she was just trying to encourage me to come out. Maybe this is unhealthy? I'm really the happier for it you know?
I'm not really sure if I'm trying to excuse her behavior. We spoke about a lot of other things too, not just sexuality. I just enjoyed getting to know her. Honestly she's gorgeous and charming in the classroom, who wouldn't?
I don't think my professor is returning feelings if this is suspected. I know that while a student she won't see me any other way than a student. But I am definitely smitten so there IS tension because of what could be, I admit. The promise of potential emotional intimacy, as I've heard people say.
It's very hard, yes, I really want to be physical with her, and as I read what you're writing it is very difficult for me to sidestep my very real physical inclinations towards her. You can tell in our conversations we get personal sometimes and it's probably fueling this fire.
Thank you for the fore-warning, I need to take the time to really think about it. I was actually happy she's someone that will break the rules, you know, it means I have a greater chance of getting her (if you will). But I do understand I need to heed your words and think about this.
Quote from: Ruralguy on April 20, 2020, 02:17:47 PM
I'm also going to preface with "assuming that this is real ..."
and just say that you shouldn't do this.
Again, not so much that it shows anything bad about you, other than that you at 33 can't see why this might be a bad idea.
Thank you for responding. I don't want to get married and have kids if the 33 part is something that I should reflect on.
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 20, 2020, 02:28:04 PM
It's very hard, yes, I really want to be physical with her, and as I read what you're writing it is very difficult for me to sidestep my very real physical inclinations towards her. You can tell in our conversations we get personal sometimes and it's probably fueling this fire.
Thank you for the fore-warning, I need to take the time to really think about it. I was actually happy she's someone that will break the rules, you know, it means I have a greater chance of getting her (if you will). But I do understand I need to heed your words and think about this.
Much of what you say here indicates that you're much more focussed on a personal relationship than a professional one. If the latter is actually important, then the former has the potential to blow it all up. (As everyone else has said.)
And as some have said, crushes (in either direction) are not at all surprising. But acting on them crosses lines that can't be uncrossed.
Quote from: marshwiggle on April 20, 2020, 02:35:02 PM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 20, 2020, 02:28:04 PM
It's very hard, yes, I really want to be physical with her, and as I read what you're writing it is very difficult for me to sidestep my very real physical inclinations towards her. You can tell in our conversations we get personal sometimes and it's probably fueling this fire.
Thank you for the fore-warning, I need to take the time to really think about it. I was actually happy she's someone that will break the rules, you know, it means I have a greater chance of getting her (if you will). But I do understand I need to heed your words and think about this.
Much of what you say here indicates that you're much more focussed on a personal relationship than a professional one. If the latter is actually important, then the former has the potential to blow it all up. (As everyone else has said.)
And as some have said, crushes (in either direction) are not at all surprising. But acting on them crosses lines that can't be uncrossed.
Yes, I have no intention of crossing these lines with her while I work with her or expect to have a professional relationship with her. I haven't really kept up a personal relation with her while we are working together but behind the scenes yes I am kind of eager to get to know her. It's true.
Maybe for the professional relationship to work better I need to get a handle on these personal notions. It's hard for me to evaluate whether pursuing this is a good idea, crush logic and all, but you have all warned me against it which I hope will help tilt me in a new direction!
Having married a hot professor who was teaching a course I was taking, I say: go for it!
If it's any help, I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body.
I also wonder more generally if campus culture and country has a play in how appropriate certain things are for professors and students. The fact that I go to a liberal university in Canada?
Quote from: spork on April 20, 2020, 02:42:43 PM
Having married a hot professor who was teaching a course I was taking, I say: go for it!
If it's any help, I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body.
HAHAHA, this made me laugh.
Assuming this is true ;)
Yes, she's a babe, but this opens pandora's box my friend. Am I even her type? Am I equally as attractive, having a vagina just doesn't cut it you know?
Hi OP. Canadian professor here.
No. It's still really inappropriate (best case scenario).
Quote from: Morden on April 20, 2020, 04:05:43 PM
Hi OP. Canadian professor here.
No. It's still really inappropriate (best case scenario).
Thank you.
While I agree with others that it sounds like there may have been inappropriate conduct by your professor, I also hear you saying that you are interested in pursuing this relationship further. If this is the case, I would remind you that it is also your responsibility to behave in a professional manner. While a professor has the primary responsibility for making certain that the educational environment (and instructor-student relationships therein) is fair and free of harrassment, students must also not instigate such situations. It is helpful to keep in mind that there are two people that could be hurt if you pursue this: you and the professor. I would also caution that if you are interested in going to graduate school to study topics related to what you have been learning from this professor, it is also better to avoid a personal relationship even after you have graduated, as most research communities are close-knit and such a relationship could reflect poorly both on you and the professor in question. It is fine to admire a professor for their research, teaching, and/or service. Just don't act on that in a way that could be misinterpreted and put your professional career in jeopardy.
Quote from: arcturus on April 20, 2020, 04:33:01 PM
While I agree with others that it sounds like there may have been inappropriate conduct by your professor, I also hear you saying that you are interested in pursuing this relationship further. If this is the case, I would remind you that it is also your responsibility to behave in a professional manner. While a professor has the primary responsibility for making certain that the educational environment (and instructor-student relationships therein) is fair and free of harrassment, students must also not instigate such situations. It is helpful to keep in mind that there are two people that could be hurt if you pursue this: you and the professor. I would also caution that if you are interested in going to graduate school to study topics related to what you have been learning from this professor, it is also better to avoid a personal relationship even after you have graduated, as most research communities are close-knit and such a relationship could reflect poorly both on you and the professor in question. It is fine to admire a professor for their research, teaching, and/or service. Just don't act on that in a way that could be misinterpreted and put your professional career in jeopardy.
Extremely wise and helpful advise. This one really hit home.
I do wonder if somehow I "instigated" her questioning by having the crush, you know, maybe she thought I was going to come onto her or that I was being disrespectful to her in class by staring? I did stand close to her a few times when we were talking.
I do understand how this could be uncomfortable for a professor. But you know I haven't done things like linger outside her door, or try to pry into her personal life or touch myself in her presence you know? Again, trying to understand but may need to accept there was some misconduct!
My crush brain will need to accept this reality, about research being a closed knit field and that action after graduation could be harmful to both of us.
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 20, 2020, 12:45:57 PM
To be honest, I never really thought about it that way. I think she brought it to light because she does reserach on LGBT people and wanted to offer me a position in her lab. Second, I think she was concerned about my behaviour, maybe I was staring? Maybe I was talking to much to her after class?
I haven't had this happen to me, but I do know instructors who have had students who seemed overly interested in them, hung around too long, seemed too familiar etc. They responded by creating really firm boundaries, avoiding chit chat and telling the student they had to run and couldn't talk after class. I'm not sure you were really doing anything inappropriate or weird, but if you were, any non creepy person with any sense, would see this as a potentially risky situation. If a student didn't take the hint and continued to act strangely, I'd talk to my chair and the dean of students. I would not in a million years ask the student if they were attracted to me.
I think you're allowing yourself to take the blame for someone else's inappropriate behavior. I doubt you were doing anything outrageous or obvious. I suspect it is actually that your professor is paying too much attention to her students.
Quote from: Caracal on April 20, 2020, 05:20:31 PM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 20, 2020, 12:45:57 PM
To be honest, I never really thought about it that way. I think she brought it to light because she does reserach on LGBT people and wanted to offer me a position in her lab. Second, I think she was concerned about my behaviour, maybe I was staring? Maybe I was talking to much to her after class?
I haven't had this happen to me, but I do know instructors who have had students who seemed overly interested in them, hung around too long, seemed too familiar etc. They responded by creating really firm boundaries, avoiding chit chat and telling the student they had to run and couldn't talk after class. I'm not sure you were really doing anything inappropriate or weird, but if you were, any non creepy person with any sense, would see this as a potentially risky situation. If a student didn't take the hint and continued to act strangely, I'd talk to my chair and the dean of students. I would not in a million years ask the student if they were attracted to me.
I think you're allowing yourself to take the blame for someone else's inappropriate behavior. I doubt you were doing anything outrageous or obvious. I suspect it is actually that your professor is paying too much attention to her students.
It's possible that I was overly familiar with her, but this was after she got personal with me in her office. She told me about her life, so I did the same. I think she did try to keep chit chat to the minimum after this, but I didn't linger any longer than I needed to unless it was class related. The slightly long stares do come out sometimes though.
You know, she recently told me that her ex-husband slept with a student <-- I think, this is a red flag, from what you all have been telling me.
I hear what you're saying altogether, and I do realize I might be unduly taking blame.
Get your professional scene taken care of first. Then maybe you can get something going later. Careers are a minefield, but romance is even worse, even without these complications. Sorry, I'm weatherbeaten, fearful and negative, but at least I'm practical.
Quote from: mahagonny on April 20, 2020, 05:58:07 PM
Get your professional scene taken care of first. Then maybe you can get something going later. Careers are a minefield, but romance is even worse, even without these complications. Sorry, I'm weatherbeaten, fearful and negative, but at least I'm practical.
I like your honesty and it's good advise!
If she thought you were going to come on to her, she should have made sure she saw you only in public places and very rigorously avoided any personal talk whatsoever. Telling you about her sexual inclinations and her ex-husband's sex life is so inappropriate I can hardly express it. Both of you have no idea of appropriate boundaries whatsoever. And it sounds as if both of you have no inclination to learn. Whereas she could get fired from the ensuing debacle (yes, even at a liberal Canadian university), you probably have less at stake, other than scuppering your chances at a career in the field you're studying. In my experience, there are some people who are not averse to drama and high intrigue, even if the fall-out is harmful, and my guess is that you may be birds of a feather in that respect. Since, as I surmise, you're not interested in weighing whether the relationship would be healthy, I guess there's not much else we can tell you.
Quote from: Hegemony on April 20, 2020, 10:47:32 PM
If she thought you were going to come on to her, she should have made sure she saw you only in public places and very rigorously avoided any personal talk whatsoever. Telling you about her sexual inclinations and her ex-husband's sex life is so inappropriate I can hardly express it. Both of you have no idea of appropriate boundaries whatsoever. And it sounds as if both of you have no inclination to learn. Whereas she could get fired from the ensuing debacle (yes, even at a liberal Canadian university), you probably have less at stake, other than scuppering your chances at a career in the field you're studying. In my experience, there are some people who are not averse to drama and high intrigue, even if the fall-out is harmful, and my guess is that you may be birds of a feather in that respect. Since, as I surmise, you're not interested in weighing whether the relationship would be healthy, I guess there's not much else we can tell you.
This post is harsh. But I understand where you're coming from. I haven't been weighing enough whether the relationship is justifiable or not given the possible fallout. I htink arcturus's points are relevant here also.
Just coming back in to comment on Jane_Fran_2025's comment that this professor does research on LGBT people. If this is literally her area of research, then she should be doubly sensitive to the social and professional problems inherent in the comments she's been making. Even if she researched particle physics or ethnomusicology, I'd expert her to behave appropriately, but if she thinks this is appropriate while simultaneously researching issues related to sexuality, then that suggests she's not only unprofessional, but also bad at her job..
Quote from: ergative on April 21, 2020, 12:05:18 AM
Just coming back in to comment on Jane_Fran_2025's comment that this professor does research on LGBT people. If this is literally her area of research, then she should be doubly sensitive to the social and professional problems inherent in the comments she's been making. Even if she researched particle physics or ethnomusicology, I'd expert her to behave appropriately, but if she thinks this is appropriate while simultaneously researching issues related to sexuality, then that suggests she's not only unprofessional, but also bad at her job..
You're right and I've made this point very publicly at school (pre-corona).
I wish that I could disclose more context to talk about it and get more clarity, but I wouldn't want this post to be too accurate. If anyone is open to a PM, I guess you can ding me. But for now, I agree with what you've said!
Thank you for all your helpful commentary.
Quote from: ergative on April 21, 2020, 12:05:18 AM
Just coming back in to comment on Jane_Fran_2025's comment that this professor does research on LGBT people. If this is literally her area of research, then she should be doubly sensitive to the social and professional problems inherent in the comments she's been making. Even if she researched particle physics or ethnomusicology, I'd expert her to behave appropriately, but if she thinks this is appropriate while simultaneously researching issues related to sexuality, then that suggests she's not only unprofessional, but also bad at her job..
This comment is hard to unpack. I am really of the attitude my professor meant no harm. There are complexities to the scenario I haven't mentioned and perhaps, yes, her delivery was poor. I'm not going to continue to hold her accountable for that, she's doing a lot for me professionally and unfortunately, I'm also in this situation. Just gatta deal.
Most of us have had some sort of crush, possibly even mutual, that would likely have been inappropriate if it had become a relationship. So, I think most of us understand that aspect.
But it starts to go off the rails when both parties seem to accelerate the situation.
If you both accept that and are open about it all, then go forward, but realize the risks, and realize that the legal and educational systems in your country may not be on your side (either of you).
[By the way...that earlier comment about not having kids....not sure what that had to do with my post...still scratching my bald head over that one....]
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 12:33:04 AM
Thank you for all your helpful commentary.
So, Jane_Fran_2025,
(A) are you going to actually act on the information indicating what a terrible idea becoming romantically involved with your professor is likely to be
or
(B) are you going to go with drama and a possible long-shot success because we can't possibly know with 100% certainty that this will go badly for you and all those books/movies/television shows about forbidden love tend to have a pretty good success rate for those who just want it enough to ignore conventional wisdom?
Or, if you really want to make sure you don't blow it, stop working with this professor now and find another one you can finish your studies with.
Quote from: Ruralguy on April 21, 2020, 08:47:50 AM
Most of us have had some sort of crush, possibly even mutual, that would likely have been inappropriate if it had become a relationship. So, I think most of us understand that aspect.
But it starts to go off the rails when both parties seem to accelerate the situation.
If you both accept that and are open about it all, then go forward, but realize the risks, and realize that the legal and educational systems in your country may not be on your side (either of you).
[By the way...that earlier comment about not having kids....not sure what that had to do with my post...still scratching my bald head over that one....]
Keep scratching! I don't remember what I meant!
I respect this answer. I think we are both ok with things. We are quite open and honest with each other and I'm actually ok with that. I rather clear the air.
For the future of things, I'm more worried about reputation and gossip. Legal would be a-ok after graduation.
Quote from: polly_mer on April 21, 2020, 09:12:45 AM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 12:33:04 AM
Thank you for all your helpful commentary.
So, Jane_Fran_2025,
(A) are you going to actually act on the information indicating what a terrible idea becoming romantically involved with your professor is likely to be
or
(B) are you going to go with drama and a possible long-shot success because we can't possibly know with 100% certainty that this will go badly for you and all those books/movies/television shows about forbidden love tend to have a pretty good success rate for those who just want it enough to ignore conventional wisdom?
Someone brought it to my attention more personally that, me pursuing her is a real threat to her well-being. You know, I know the situation is fraught with drama and everyone has an opinion. But for me, my feeling is that I do want to get to know her, and that means I care for that person I want to know, for whatever that's worth. This person has also really inspired me elsewhere.
I think the best possible scenario is a professional friendship. If after I let go, some years go by, after I finish my studies. We will see. My #1 priority is to do no harm, if I can't possibly approach her without doing harm, I can't approach her.
Quote from: Ruralguy on April 21, 2020, 08:47:50 AM
Most of us have had some sort of crush, possibly even mutual, that would likely have been inappropriate if it had become a relationship. So, I think most of us understand that aspect.
But it starts to go off the rails when both parties seem to accelerate the situation.
This is very true. Younger people tend to invest crushes with a lot of meaning. As I've gotten older, they don't seem particularly important. Part of that might be that the costs and risks of keeping alive a crush are usually small when you're younger. I had a crush on my best friend's girlfriend for about 6 years in my teens and early 20s. She didn't leave him fro me, alas, but if she had it would have just been sort of awkward in my friend group. There wouldn't have been professional implications. I had time to really indulge it, because most of that time there really wasn't a lot going on in my romantic life. We finally did date and realized that we were very compatible as friends and totally incompatible as a couple.
I think of a crush as when I get to know someone and realize that if I we were both 23, single and I had met this person through my softball league or whatever, I would be thinking "oh, I like them, I feel like maybe there's a little rapport here, maybe I should ask them out." Twenty-Three year old me would not have asked them out, sadly, but he would have thought a lot about it. The older you get, the more experience you have of that feeling attaching itself to various situations in which acting on, or even indulging those feelings, would be a bad idea. This isn't actually torturous, because for most of us pursuing these things isn't particularly appealing. I feel awkward exchanging banal greetings with colleagues in the hallway without having any torrid, forbidden love affairs. '
That your professor isn't thinking this way is a little alarming. I think the reason all of us are so much more leery about her behavior than you are, is because we have a sense of just what a weird, complicated, likely unpleasant situation she is allowing herself to become enmeshed in. She may well have a crush on you too, but she could just file that away in "feelings that are not relevant to my job or life" and move on. She doesn't need to wear a hair shirt, or avoid talking to you. She just can ignore a totally harmless feeling. Why not? Well most of the options aren't great. Maybe she's going through a bad personal stretch, feels bad about herself and enjoys the attention you're giving her. Maybe she just pursues people whenever she has any interest in them, no matter the circumstances. Maybe, despite being older, she is just immature and likes to get swept away on these things. Perhaps she is immature, and would prefer to date younger people who don't challenge her, and finds that the sort of young people inclined to be starstruck by her, can much more easily be found in her classrooms than through online dating.
Or, maybe it is just that you guys have a deep connection. I know people who started dating in dubious circumstances and made it work. So who knows. I think one of the less appealing explanations of the professors behavior is a lot more likely, however, and if I'm right, this really isn't the sort of person you want to get into a relationship with. I worry that you're likely to get hurt.
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 09:40:47 AM
Quote from: polly_mer on April 21, 2020, 09:12:45 AM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 12:33:04 AM
Thank you for all your helpful commentary.
So, Jane_Fran_2025,
(A) are you going to actually act on the information indicating what a terrible idea becoming romantically involved with your professor is likely to be
or
(B) are you going to go with drama and a possible long-shot success because we can't possibly know with 100% certainty that this will go badly for you and all those books/movies/television shows about forbidden love tend to have a pretty good success rate for those who just want it enough to ignore conventional wisdom?
Someone brought it to my attention more personally that, me pursuing her is a real threat to her well-being. You know, I know the situation is fraught with drama and everyone has an opinion. But for me, my feeling is that I do want to get to know her, and that means I care for that person I want to know, for whatever that's worth. This person has also really inspired me elsewhere.
I think the best possible scenario is a professional friendship. If after I let go, some years go by, after I finish my studies. We will see. My #1 priority is to do no harm, if I can't possibly approach her without doing harm, I can't approach her.
So you've opted for drama.
OK.
I look forward to seeing your letter in one of the usual relationship advice columns where the entire commentariat points out the entirely foreseeable tragedy that could have been avoided at the beginning by taking the logical action that doesn't result in drama and then extra, extra drama when it all blows up.
Quote from: Caracal on April 22, 2020, 06:05:40 AM
Quote from: Ruralguy on April 21, 2020, 08:47:50 AM
Most of us have had some sort of crush, possibly even mutual, that would likely have been inappropriate if it had become a relationship. So, I think most of us understand that aspect.
But it starts to go off the rails when both parties seem to accelerate the situation.
This is very true. Younger people tend to invest crushes with a lot of meaning. As I've gotten older, they don't seem particularly important. Part of that might be that the costs and risks of keeping alive a crush are usually small when you're younger. I had a crush on my best friend's girlfriend for about 6 years in my teens and early 20s. She didn't leave him fro me, alas, but if she had it would have just been sort of awkward in my friend group. There wouldn't have been professional implications. I had time to really indulge it, because most of that time there really wasn't a lot going on in my romantic life. We finally did date and realized that we were very compatible as friends and totally incompatible as a couple.
I think of a crush as when I get to know someone and realize that if I we were both 23, single and I had met this person through my softball league or whatever, I would be thinking "oh, I like them, I feel like maybe there's a little rapport here, maybe I should ask them out." Twenty-Three year old me would not have asked them out, sadly, but he would have thought a lot about it. The older you get, the more experience you have of that feeling attaching itself to various situations in which acting on, or even indulging those feelings, would be a bad idea. This isn't actually torturous, because for most of us pursuing these things isn't particularly appealing. I feel awkward exchanging banal greetings with colleagues in the hallway without having any torrid, forbidden love affairs. '
That your professor isn't thinking this way is a little alarming. I think the reason all of us are so much more leery about her behavior than you are, is because we have a sense of just what a weird, complicated, likely unpleasant situation she is allowing herself to become enmeshed in. She may well have a crush on you too, but she could just file that away in "feelings that are not relevant to my job or life" and move on. She doesn't need to wear a hair shirt, or avoid talking to you.
She just can ignore a totally harmless feeling. Why not? Well most of the options aren't great. Maybe she's going through a bad personal stretch, feels bad about herself and enjoys the attention you're giving her. Maybe she just pursues people whenever she has any interest in them, no matter the circumstances. Maybe, despite being older, she is just immature and likes to get swept away on these things. Perhaps she is immature, and would prefer to date younger people who don't challenge her, and finds that the sort of young people inclined to be starstruck by her, can much more easily be found in her classrooms than through online dating.
Or, maybe it is just that you guys have a deep connection. I know people who started dating in dubious circumstances and made it work. So who knows. I think one of the less appealing explanations of the professors behavior is a lot more likely, however, and if I'm right, this really isn't the sort of person you want to get into a relationship with. I worry that you're likely to get hurt.
Thank you for sharing your perspective. I wanted the perspective of professors, because I obviously can't see from your side of the table.
I'm single and I like dating, and I enjoy investing in beautiful women, but only if they are truly worth my time. I invest because I have the time.
After you guys have spoken to me, I did notice that my professor stares back at me when I stare, because I sometimes stare. I caught her walking into her office while I was going into a class and she stared back very pleasantly at me, but please, my crush brain is so real. I'm assuming if she was worried she should have shut this down? We also have had some serious stares in her office that I didn't realize was happening till much later into our staring competition, but I think I"m partly to blame for that. She sometimes fixes her hair when I'm in the office, it happened once, my crush brain noticed, but I see that as a sign of being comfortable.
Maybe she does like the attention?
More than likely, maybe I was making her uncomfortable and instead of going to the dean she was trying to tell me. This is the kinder option. I don't think that's too far away from the truth, though the other option was to ignore. I heard a story the other day about a female professor who felt unsafe because a male student had decided she was into him. Maybe she thought I thought she was into me, or that I was secretly trying to get with her. I wasn't. This would explain a lot. (But I again, I don't linger, stalk, touch, or have unrelated, meaningless conversation with her. I do sometimes stand too close to her but I very OPENLY and FORCEFULLY back away, lol.) I don't really see the problem with finding someone attractive or having a crush.
And I haven't learnt what you have spoken about, on how to ignore it and have no interest in pursuing the crushes I experience.
I'm sorry, I'm still wrapping my head around all you've told me. Yes, from your perspective I can see how, from all the other optinos you've given me, how this can be construed as inappropriate.
Quote from: polly_mer on April 22, 2020, 06:16:34 AM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 09:40:47 AM
Quote from: polly_mer on April 21, 2020, 09:12:45 AM
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 21, 2020, 12:33:04 AM
Thank you for all your helpful commentary.
So, Jane_Fran_2025,
(A) are you going to actually act on the information indicating what a terrible idea becoming romantically involved with your professor is likely to be
or
(B) are you going to go with drama and a possible long-shot success because we can't possibly know with 100% certainty that this will go badly for you and all those books/movies/television shows about forbidden love tend to have a pretty good success rate for those who just want it enough to ignore conventional wisdom?
Someone brought it to my attention more personally that, me pursuing her is a real threat to her well-being. You know, I know the situation is fraught with drama and everyone has an opinion. But for me, my feeling is that I do want to get to know her, and that means I care for that person I want to know, for whatever that's worth. This person has also really inspired me elsewhere.
I think the best possible scenario is a professional friendship. If after I let go, some years go by, after I finish my studies. We will see. My #1 priority is to do no harm, if I can't possibly approach her without doing harm, I can't approach her.
So you've opted for drama.
OK.
I look forward to seeing your letter in one of the usual relationship advice columns where the entire commentariat points out the entirely foreseeable tragedy that could have been avoided at the beginning by taking the logical action that doesn't result in drama and then extra, extra drama when it all blows up.
I mean I didn't say yes or no, I said I would avoid harm, to me, and to her. I'm not a robot.
Now that I'm finally talking about this:
I think my teacher was trying to get me to talk about sexuality, because she wanted me to openly discuss it with my other classmates. Teaching me what to teach. I didn't end up doing this with them because I didn't want to, instead, I opened up to her because that's how she was choosing to connect with me and who would waste an opportunity to connect with a prof. And a beautiful one at that. She might have subsequently asked me about the crush in an attempt to clarify whether I misinterpreted her.
Quote from: Jane_Fran_2025 on April 22, 2020, 01:24:41 PM
Now that I'm finally talking about this:
I think my teacher was trying to get me to talk about sexuality, because she wanted me to openly discuss it with my other classmates. Teaching me what to teach. I didn't end up doing this with them because I didn't want to, instead, I opened up to her because that's how she was choosing to connect with me and who would waste an opportunity to connect with a prof. And a beautiful one at that. She might have subsequently asked me about the crush in an attempt to clarify whether I misinterpreted her.
Wait, she asked you in class if you were gay? Or somewhere else in front of other students? Oy.
I can't answer this fully. Just know that I was asked.