The Fora: A Higher Education Community

Is yours a bullsh!t job?  Read below and see.

https://www.strike.coop/bullshit-jobs/

To philosophize a bit: doesn't this assume that the fundamental role of the university is not bullshit? And that contemporary western societies are not largely replicators of bullshit?

I find meaning in loving relationships, intense experiences, personal challenges, communing with nature, and thinking about stuff. Then there is passing my time with entertainment. Since I'm not a hermit, I have to participate in some of the things that society values, but I do so without taking them seriously. I'm not convinced that most university education is particularly intrincially useful to anyone, but it creates employment. Unfortunately, it also creates massive student debt too. That's a problem.

So when the author writes "How can one even begin to speak of dignity in labour when one secretly feels one's job should not exist?" I think the answer is: it is quite easy. You take the cash. You focus on what you like doing. If you like, you can contribute to efforts to make society less ridiculous and unfair. I don't see why you need to have to have a profound sense of alienation though. Have a laugh.

I have the book.  Even though it is fascinating to read I have never personally known someone with a BS job that fits his definition. 

Mine doesn't technically fit the bill, but I think it is a BS job anyway. Because I'm clearly a cog in the wheel that exploits our under-prepared international students while leaving them entirely under-served. I do what I can and treat it like I would its non-BS counterpart, but there's a lot about it that doesn't feel very good and leaves me feeling like I'm just going through the motions for a paycheque.

I think the whole premise of the article is flawed.

Quote
In the year 1930, John Maynard Keynes predicted that, by century's end, technology would have advanced sufficiently that countries like Great Britain or the United States would have achieved a 15-hour work week.

In the '50's, my parents built their own house. It was about 900 square feet, for 6 people. They had one black and white TV to watch broadcast (i.e. free) television. There was one phone line for the entire household. And it was a party line at that. (Younger people can look that up if it doesn't mean anything.) They had one car; a Volkswagen Beetle.

Right now, my house is about 3x the size of my parents' house, for half as many people. We have two cars, both much bigger than the Beetle, and we have 2 phone lines for the house, as well as cell phone plans for each member of the household. We have high speed Internet and streaming television.

If we chose to live like my parents did, we could probably do it on 15 hours of work per week. Our voracious appetite for comfort and convenience is what fuels the economy. BS jobs exist because we all have things we hate to have to do, and so if we can find someone willing to do them for an amount we are wiling to pay, then we'll do it. Does that make it a BS job? Why? We get it done and someone else gets an income.

The only BS job is one you stay in when you're unhappy but unwilling to seriously examine alternatives.

So, where's the choice for independent scholars, adjuncts, and other positions?

I'm not a small nail holding a great girder through blue nights into white stars, but I value my work and I believe from the feedback I get that it's valued in its own sphere.

Just a thought..

M.

I say that I teach a third of my students, babysit a third of my students, and fail a third of my students.

Quote from: marshwiggle on July 06, 2020, 10:21:55 AM
I think the whole premise of the article is flawed.

Quote
In the year 1930, John Maynard Keynes predicted that, by century's end, technology would have advanced sufficiently that countries like Great Britain or the United States would have achieved a 15-hour work week.

In the '50's, my parents built their own house. It was about 900 square feet, for 6 people. They had one black and white TV to watch broadcast (i.e. free) television. There was one phone line for the entire household. And it was a party line at that. (Younger people can look that up if it doesn't mean anything.) They had one car; a Volkswagen Beetle.

Right now, my house is about 3x the size of my parents' house, for half as many people. We have two cars, both much bigger than the Beetle, and we have 2 phone lines for the house, as well as cell phone plans for each member of the household. We have high speed Internet and streaming television.

If we chose to live like my parents did, we could probably do it on 15 hours of work per week. Our voracious appetite for comfort and convenience is what fuels the economy. BS jobs exist because we all have things we hate to have to do, and so if we can find someone willing to do them for an amount we are wiling to pay, then we'll do it. Does that make it a BS job? Why? We get it done and someone else gets an income.

The only BS job is one you stay in when you're unhappy but unwilling to seriously examine alternatives.

Absolutely, Marsh!

But it gets worse, much worse. Thinking of bullshit jobs, college administration comes to mind. Why so much? Government mandated in the US. Lawyers? Why so many? Contingent fees in the US mandated by state and federal governments. I could go on.

This stuff will differ across countries, with some adding bad stuff. It's hard work to figure it all out in detail. Not a bullshit job; therefore, not for journalists or activists.

Quote from: mamselle on July 06, 2020, 11:48:09 AM
So, where's the choice for independent scholars, adjuncts, and other positions?

I'm assuming this is a response to me. If not, I apologize.

A person can always be a scholar, artist, musician, etc., whether or not anyone will pay them to do it. The whole premise of the article seems to be that lots of people are in unfulfilling jobs, rather than being able to live off being creative.

I don't imagine anyone enjoys maintaining my sewage system. I wouldn't like to live in a dwelling that I am capable of building from scratch on my own, with only the infrastructure I can create myself. That would essentially be cave-dwelling, if I could find a cave. In order to have things like elctricity, running water, etc., we need tons of infrastructure, including things like sewage which necessitates someone doing unpleasant maintenance tasks. (I suppose, along that line, that mucking out stalls on a farm would literally be a BS job.) No-one is guaranteed a fun job. The goal people should have is to try and find something that they can live with, which pays enough for them to have a fulfilling life outside their work. And any job that fills that requirement would not be, in my opinion, a BS job; it would be a job to pay the rent so that the more important elements of life (relationships, personal development, etc.) can happen outside.

All jobs are bullsh!t.

That's why they have to pay us to do them.

My trainer in the big company could not comprehend my quip that none of the money we processed every day actually existed, it was all simply numbers in a database. Grades are exactly the same thing, if you think about them.

There's also that great line from The Wire: "We used to make things in this country.  Now we just stick our hands in the other guy's pocket."

The biggest bullshit job at my last university: Director of Assessment.

Enough said.

There's a very simple way to ascertain that my job definitely is not bullshit. The department chair acts like he's threatening us by saying "the provost doesn't believe we really need your work here, but we insist that your work is important. We make him understand -- almost. At least for now!!!...(sigh)." 
Both these crumbums are working together, of course.

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on July 06, 2020, 02:43:06 PM
All jobs are bullsh!t.

I don't know. Subsistence farmer doesn't sound like a bullshit job. Happily, many more of us will have that profession if the Left continues to rack up the wins.

Also, why is the entire article we're all discussing in bolded font? Does someone have the bullshit job of making digital prose unreadable?

Quote from: writingprof on July 06, 2020, 05:10:49 PM

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on July 06, 2020, 02:43:06 PM
All jobs are bullsh!t.

I don't know. Subsistence farmer doesn't sound like a bullshit job. Happily, many more of us will have that profession if the Left continues to rack up the wins.

Also, why is the entire article we're all discussing in bolded font? Does someone have the bullshit job of making digital prose unreadable?

Well, it is the STRIKE! website, and the STRIKE! icon scrolls with the page, to give it that comic-book Every-sentence-ends-with-an-explanation-point vibe.

What to do when deep down you know your arguments themselves don't really have a lot to recommend them. SHOUT!!!!!!

I loved this article. This is exactly why I quit academia and stopped working at 47. I gradually realized that my job was a BS job and always would be (and I no longer needed the $$$). You wouldn't believe the pushback I got on this decision. But what are you going to do with your time? But you're wasting your degree! But you would be happier if you were at least an adjunct. You need to do something! As if nothing counts unless you are paid at least a token salary.

I am 56 now and have never regretted my decision.

Quote from: Treehugger on July 06, 2020, 05:54:22 PM
I loved this article. This is exactly why I quit academia and stopped working at 47. I gradually realized that my job was a BS job and always would be (and I no longer needed the $$$). You wouldn't believe the pushback I got on this decision. But what are you going to do with your time? But you're wasting your degree! But you would be happier if you were at least an adjunct. You need to do something! As if nothing counts unless you are paid at least a token salary.

I am 56 now and have never regretted my decision.

I am just curious.  Can you tell us how you made a living after age 47?

Quote from: Anselm on July 06, 2020, 06:42:51 PM

Quote from: Treehugger on July 06, 2020, 05:54:22 PM
I loved this article. This is exactly why I quit academia and stopped working at 47. I gradually realized that my job was a BS job and always would be (and I no longer needed the $$$). You wouldn't believe the pushback I got on this decision. But what are you going to do with your time? But you're wasting your degree! But you would be happier if you were at least an adjunct. You need to do something! As if nothing counts unless you are paid at least a token salary.

I am 56 now and have never regretted my decision.

I am just curious.  Can you tell us how you made a living after age 47?

I'm not making a living.

As I understand it from the article, what is meant by bullshit jobs is a job that is neither societally useful nor fulfilling for the worker. Thus sewage maintenance wouldn't be a BS job, however unpleasant, because it is in fact necessary, nor would being say a painter, even if society could clearly function indefinitely without your work. I do care about my research, and I think my teaching is somewhat societally useful, so my job wouldn't be a BS job by that definition. I've had BS tasks, been BS chair and been on BS committees, though. The point the article was making is that BS jobs are often well-paid while non-BS jobs are often both poorly paid and looked down upon societally (teachers, bus drivers, factory workers), which I think is hard to argue against.

Quote from: Anselm on July 06, 2020, 09:18:37 AM
...I have never personally known someone with a BS job that fits his definition. 

At my former employer, there was a "technician" at my department who I never even met and had no duties. If you do not in fact do any work, then your job is neither societally useful nor personally rewarding, so that was definitely a BS job, although of course I can't really say I knew  him. More or less the same would go for all union officials at my former employer, and probably at my current employer as well. Yes, I know lots of folks here are strongly pro-union, but believe me, these particular unions most certainly only serve the interests their leaderships, not of their rank-and-file members.

Quote from: Treehugger on July 06, 2020, 05:54:22 PM
I loved this article. This is exactly why I quit academia and stopped working at 47. I gradually realized that my job was a BS job and always would be (and I no longer needed the $$$). You wouldn't believe the pushback I got on this decision. But what are you going to do with your time? But you're wasting your degree! But you would be happier if you were at least an adjunct. You need to do something! As if nothing counts unless you are paid at least a token salary.

I am 56 now and have never regretted my decision.

I don't consider my teaching and research to be BS tasks, but I would quit if I were independently wealthy or something. I can't remember which famous actress said it, but she said she acted for free, what she charged was for all the BS she had to put up with. So I kind of share that sentiment - if I were independently wealthy and my job only entailed research, I'd probably still do it even for free, but if I were independently wealthy in a more realistic scenario, I'd quit too.

Quote from: pepsi_alum on July 06, 2020, 04:37:35 PM
The biggest bullshit job at my last university: Director of Assessment.

Enough said.

As director of assessment at Super Dinky, I managed to get us a 'much improved' when the accreditors came instead of an automatic "show cause" for not having improved after being told to improve.

I actually got praise from faculty for helping implement plans that improved student learning and made the cases for additional faculty/resources to improve various programs including general education.

I don't know that I've had a true BS job, but I agree with other posters that I get paid excellent money now to put up with the institutional foolishness that makes my job harder and the most exhausting day-to-day jobs paid the least with the lowest job security.

Quote from: Treehugger on July 06, 2020, 06:44:36 PM

Quote from: Anselm on July 06, 2020, 06:42:51 PM

Quote from: Treehugger on July 06, 2020, 05:54:22 PM
I loved this article. This is exactly why I quit academia and stopped working at 47. I gradually realized that my job was a BS job and always would be (and I no longer needed the $$$). You wouldn't believe the pushback I got on this decision. But what are you going to do with your time? But you're wasting your degree! But you would be happier if you were at least an adjunct. You need to do something! As if nothing counts unless you are paid at least a token salary.

I am 56 now and have never regretted my decision.

I am just curious.  Can you tell us how you made a living after age 47?

I'm not making a living.

Are you homeless? Are you on the dole? Are you supported by a working partner? Did you receive a large inheritance? Come on, Treehugger. We want to be like you and need more specific information.