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Cancel culture in Higher Ed

Started by Langue_doc, April 16, 2024, 01:31:55 PM

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dismalist

Quote from: apl68 on April 17, 2024, 02:35:32 PMDon't know much about the Columbia situation, but evidently things have gotten pretty hot on campus there over the issue.  One has to feel sorry for their leadership caught up in this.  At least their head has so far learned lessons from the spectacular career suicide that occurred over at Harvard.

The leadership of Columbia has allowed Columbia behavior. No people to feel sorry for.

The lesson, rather, is, that the incentives facing university administrators are to let local interest groups run wild, the consequences be damned. No skin off the admins' back. Or, there's too much money around! :-)
That's not even wrong!
--Wolfgang Pauli

secundem_artem

Quote from: marshwiggle on April 17, 2024, 01:05:28 PMYork University faculty group recommends defining support of Israel as 'racism'


QuoteA York University faculty committee has recommended that the school henceforth define any acknowledgement of Israel's existence as evidence of "anti-Palestinian racism."

According to an April 5 "recommendations report" leaked to National Post, an official committee within York's Department of Politics has proposed that any defence of Israel be viewed as "anti-Palestinian, Islamophobic, and anti-Arab."

An odd addition:
Quote"The struggle for Palestinian self-determination will support the liberation of all humans and non-humans from colonial oppression," it reads.

U Toronto grad here.  Sounds about right for York. 
Funeral by funeral, the academy advances

Wahoo Redux

Quote from: dismalist on April 17, 2024, 03:01:56 PM
Quote from: apl68 on April 17, 2024, 02:35:32 PMDon't know much about the Columbia situation, but evidently things have gotten pretty hot on campus there over the issue.  One has to feel sorry for their leadership caught up in this.  At least their head has so far learned lessons from the spectacular career suicide that occurred over at Harvard.

The leadership of Columbia has allowed Columbia behavior. No people to feel sorry for.

The lesson, rather, is, that the incentives facing university administrators are to let local interest groups run wild, the consequences be damned. No skin off the admins' back. Or, there's too much money around! :-)

How does college leadership "allow" this kind of behavior?  How does one stop "local interest groups" from "running wild" on a college campus?

Half the time I don't know what you are talking about, Big-D.
Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

marshwiggle

Quote from: secundem_artem on April 17, 2024, 05:40:10 PM
Quote from: marshwiggle on April 17, 2024, 01:05:28 PMYork University faculty group recommends defining support of Israel as 'racism'


QuoteA York University faculty committee has recommended that the school henceforth define any acknowledgement of Israel's existence as evidence of "anti-Palestinian racism."

According to an April 5 "recommendations report" leaked to National Post, an official committee within York's Department of Politics has proposed that any defence of Israel be viewed as "anti-Palestinian, Islamophobic, and anti-Arab."

An odd addition:
Quote"The struggle for Palestinian self-determination will support the liberation of all humans and non-humans from colonial oppression," it reads.

U Toronto grad here.  Sounds about right for York. 

Yeah, that was my take as well.
It takes so little to be above average.

apl68

Quote from: Wahoo Redux on April 17, 2024, 07:38:38 PM
Quote from: dismalist on April 17, 2024, 03:01:56 PM
Quote from: apl68 on April 17, 2024, 02:35:32 PMDon't know much about the Columbia situation, but evidently things have gotten pretty hot on campus there over the issue.  One has to feel sorry for their leadership caught up in this.  At least their head has so far learned lessons from the spectacular career suicide that occurred over at Harvard.

The leadership of Columbia has allowed Columbia behavior. No people to feel sorry for.

The lesson, rather, is, that the incentives facing university administrators are to let local interest groups run wild, the consequences be damned. No skin off the admins' back. Or, there's too much money around! :-)

How does college leadership "allow" this kind of behavior?  How does one stop "local interest groups" from "running wild" on a college campus?

Half the time I don't know what you are talking about, Big-D.

There's not any way for admins to prevent (or not) controversial speech and activism on campus when passions on an issue are running this high without seriously offending somebody.  It's a no-win situation for them.  I can't help feeling sorry for admins confronted with a situation like this, even if I don't agree with particular aspects of their handling of it.  At least if they show some common sense in the process.
And you will cry out on that day because of the king you have chosen for yourselves, and the Lord will not hear you on that day.

dismalist

Quote from: apl68 on April 18, 2024, 07:26:52 AM
Quote from: dismalist on April 17, 2024, 03:01:56 PM
Quote from: apl68 on April 17, 2024, 02:35:32 PMDon't know much about the Columbia situation, but evidently things have gotten pretty hot on campus there over the issue.  One has to feel sorry for their leadership caught up in this.  At least their head has so far learned lessons from the spectacular career suicide that occurred over at Harvard.

The leadership of Columbia has allowed Columbia behavior. No people to feel sorry for.

The lesson, rather, is, that the incentives facing university administrators are to let local interest groups run wild, the consequences be damned. No skin off the admins' back. Or, there's too much money around! :-)


There's not any way for admins to prevent (or not) controversial speech and activism on campus when passions on an issue are running this high without seriously offending somebody.  It's a no-win situation for them.  I can't help feeling sorry for admins confronted with a situation like this, even if I don't agree with particular aspects of their handling of it.  At least if they show some common sense in the process.

So, colleges are lawless realms.
That's not even wrong!
--Wolfgang Pauli

apl68

Oh sure, they can always take measures to sanction or try to prevent speech that they fear will prove problematic.  But their measures, however lawful or in accordance with written procedure, will often court the sort of backlash from some quarters that they had hoped to prevent from others.
And you will cry out on that day because of the king you have chosen for yourselves, and the Lord will not hear you on that day.

Langue_doc

Updates on the Columbia Universtity situation:

QuoteLive Updates: Police Arresting Pro-Palestinian Protesters at Columbia
Officers began arresting students on Thursday, a day after university officials testified about antisemitism before Congress.

QuoteIn Congress, Columbia's Leaders Try to Please. At Home, They Face Anger.
For Columbia's president, Nemat Shafik, a hearing on antisemitism went relatively well. But on campus, intense protests suggest a difficult road ahead for the university.

QuoteRep. Ilhan Omar's Daughter Suspended for Involvement in Columbia Protest

QuoteHundreds of protesters occupy South Lawn, call for divestment from Israel during Shafik testimony
The group began to pitch tents in the early hours of Wednesday morning.
Isra Hirsi, the Democratic congresswoman's daughter, was part of a tent-encampment, organized to protest the war in Gaza, that has escalated tensions on campus.

Wahoo Redux

Quote from: apl68 on April 18, 2024, 07:26:52 AMThere's not any way for admins to prevent (or not) controversial speech and activism on campus when passions on an issue are running this high without seriously offending somebody.  It's a no-win situation for them.  I can't help feeling sorry for admins confronted with a situation like this, even if I don't agree with particular aspects of their handling of it.  At least if they show some common sense in the process.

Amen.  Particularly the bolded.  Particularly now that conservative politicians have found a new way to McCarthyize political theater.  Admin are fallible humans, after all, put in a frightening position.

And I find it beyond hypocritical that a conservative ideology that fostered the J6 riot can call out anybody on issues of public behavior or peoples' safety.
Come, fill the Cup, and in the fire of Spring
Your Winter-garment of Repentance fling:
The Bird of Time has but a little way
To flutter--and the Bird is on the Wing.

Ancient Fellow

Quote from: apl68 on April 17, 2024, 06:33:19 AMA class valedictorian choosing the occasion to weigh in on a tremendously emotive and polarizing issue to a captive audience--however keenly the student may personally feel about it--creates a no-win situation for all involved.  It's an abuse of the student's position.

Seems like a simple solution is for administrators to laud the academic achievement of valedictorians at graduation, but dispense with the tradition of letting them give a speech. 

Ruralguy

I think Shafik learned her lessons a bit too late. I certainly have no insights into board confidence in their president and all, but I suspect that unless much of the campus really believes there will be a change in policy regarding how to handle protests and how to react to world events, she will probably have to eventually go. I give her another year.