People On SC's: How Much Does A Potential Hire's Undergrad Institution Matter?

[gael2020]

Or regional diversity ?

[San Joaquin]

Just apply your best for jobs that fit you, then move on to the next.  If you are a fit for what they seek, they will get in contact. 

Keep looking forward or you will drive yourself bananas for no good reason.  You only control a portion of the job search process.  Do that part well.  The rest is not about you.

[Ruralguy]

At my 100-ish ranked SLAC there might be a slight bias toward hiring people with an undergraduate education at a SLAC, but its slight. In the years in which we have 5-ish hires,
maybe one or two will have that background, and everybody else is all over the place.

We don't have an ivy bias at all, for undergrad or grad. Some have that background, but its just a sprinkling.

We do tend to get more applicants from, and a bit more offers for people from  the region in general.  I don't think there's a concerted effort to hire out of the region, though some depts. just happen to be a little bit less parochial.

Since you can't go back in time and have a background you don't really have, it might make sense just to go for factors you can control. Almost all SCs appreciate excellence in scholarship to some degree. Many would also, to varying degree, appreciate excellence in teaching and service.

So, make progress in your research (publish and connect with those in your field), get teaching experience. Doing something akin to service might help too....be a grad rep to the faculty,
do something for your professional society. Don't let it distract you, but get some experience.

You can't magically get some committee at Podunk U. or Super Dinky College to not hate you because you aren't from  "The South" or Iowa or something. Don't fret over it. Just apply.

[clean]

I wont say I ve never looked at it.  IF it is someone from my institution looking to 'come home' that would be a plus.  IF it is someone that is from a different climate for all of their education, that may be a topic of conversation, IF they made it past the initial screening, but I doubt that it would keep someone from a phone interview.

For instance, IF you have always lived in a cold (warm) place and are applying to a place that is usually hot (cold) that may be an issue.
IF you grew up in Florida and are applying to some place that looks like Fargo, then someone should discuss this the candidate to be sure that they have an understanding of the environment.  Otherwise the university would find itself quickly looking again!

Likewise, if someone grew up where there are four seasons, then they may not like to live in Florida (especially if/after they experience the fifth season - Hurricane season!)

Bottom line:
IF the candidate is from the school -  A Big Plus!!
IF the candidate is from a different environment, something to talk about, but not disqualify from an interview.

[Morden]

I don't remember ever paying attention to where someone got their undergraduate degree. I do look at where they've taught--big plus if it's somewhere similar to us (public undergraduate commuter school).

[sprout]

At my community college, your bachelor's institution doesn't matter at all. But, it is a positive if you went to a community college.

[polly_mer]

In contrast, most places I've worked cared a lot about having relevant experience at a similar institution.  It didn't have to be personal undergraduate attendance, but having been burned many times by people who just didn't fit and couldn't teach the students we had, the question always came up of how the person would fit with the job we had.

For example, I can't remember a single hire at the teaching-only institution who did all their undergrad education overseas, but I can remember a few people who only made the phone interview list because they highlighted their teaching experience with a similar population.  Going to Harvard or somewhere similar was a mark against those folks unless they could make the case for understanding our type of institution, either by attending such an institution or by full-time teaching experience at such at institution along with the necessary service load.

For years on these fora, people end up at an institution very different from their undergrad and then ask the question of "what in the world is going on with these students who don't at all act like normal students".  boxerrunner is an extreme case, but far from the only person who spent multiple terms not at all willing to do the job that is necessary instead of the desired job.  Some folks even had significant issues being a TA. 

[Caracal]

It would be ridiculous and elitist for anyone to ever think about it, except for some of the considerations mentioned above. It is the equivalent of caring about someone's GPA when they have been out of college for two years. Even as a consideration for applicants to graduate programs, it would be pretty indefensible.

[Caracal]

In contrast, most places I've worked cared a lot about having relevant experience at a similar institution.  It didn't have to be personal undergraduate attendance, but having been burned many times by people who just didn't fit and couldn't teach the students we had, the question always came up of how the person would fit with the job we had.

For example, I can't remember a single hire at the teaching-only institution who did all their undergrad education overseas, but I can remember a few people who only made the phone interview list because they highlighted their teaching experience with a similar population.  Going to Harvard or somewhere similar was a mark against those folks unless they could make the case for understanding our type of institution, either by attending such an institution or by full-time teaching experience at such at institution along with the necessary service load.

For years on these fora, people end up at an institution very different from their undergrad and then ask the question of "what in the world is going on with these students who don't at all act like normal students".  boxerrunner is an extreme case, but far from the only person who spent multiple terms not at all willing to do the job that is necessary instead of the desired job.  Some folks even had significant issues being a TA. 

Perhaps, but I think if that is the concern, you would just want to ask questions that would let you assess a candidates adaptability. Experience teaching at a variety of different sorts of schools would also probably matter more than where somebody went to college six years ago. Most of the good students at my mid tier non selective state school  are basically like me in college, blissfully unaware that they are far more engaged and putting far more effort into their classes than the vast majority of other students. I'm sure if you sent most of them to grad school and then asked them to come back and teach there they would also be pretty shocked to find that most students don't care as much as they do. 

[polly_mer]

How many hiring committees at how many different types of institution have you been on, Caracal?

How many times have you personally dealt with having faculty members who are such poor fits that they don't make it out of the probationary period?

Have you ever had to intervene in the middle of someone's first term teaching because all the courses were going so poorly that they were ripping off the students to the extent that the good students were showing up in the chair's office in droves with valid concerns?

What would be "fair" in an ideal world to all job applicants tends to conflict with what "truly qualified" means on the ground.  What "truly qualified" means is institution dependent and may indeed be "unfair" to people who have great records for some other type of institution, but not for this particular institution.

When we only have three applicants for something like the nursing position, then we can interview all of them.  When we have dozens of applicants for one job and most of those applicants have little or no experience of any kind at an institution like ours, then even the phone interview will be limited to people who made a case for why they understand the job we have and truly want that job. 

For example, one of the job duties as faculty will be student recruitment and retention; being able to make the case for why students should choose this college is something we asked during interviews at many of the institutions.  One doesn't have to have been an undergraduate at this type of college, but that often helps with pitching a case on the spot that doesn't sound like reciting the mantra of "small school good; liberal arts good".

Oh, and we out here in the world do indeed look at GPA often well after college graduation.  The question is how did someone do in a learning environment.  Someone with a 2.01 and a ton of relevant experience through internships and projects is going to get an interview over the person who had a 4.0 and minimal experience even while in college.  One's life experiences matter, although any one particular experience does become less important as the overall record grows.

I do, though, know of one institution that checks undergraduate grades for every job applicant at every level no matter how long one has been out of college.  I have a friend who had to get an exemption by the president of that institution because his undergrad GPA was too low and the reason someone went to the trouble of following the exemption process was the 10 years of experience after college that made my friend a catch.  I have many colleagues now who cannot get promotions because they have a degree from the "wrong" college and 20 years experience will not matter until the person making the promotion decisions retires.

It's a lovely thought that pedigree and even GPA don't matter, but sometimes they do in practice here in the world of limited jobs and an overabundance of applicants.

[tuxthepenguin]

I'm at an R1 now and I don't ever remember the undergrad institution playing a role here or anywhere else I've worked. We want to hire people that are going to do the job.

[Cheerful]

I'm at an R1 now and I don't ever remember the undergrad institution playing a role here or anywhere else I've worked. We want to hire people that are going to do the job.

+1

[Aster]

It matters. Sometimes it barely matters if the applicant's qualifications are very good in other areas (e.g. graduate school, pubs, service).

But if an applicant is weaker or has submitted less (e.g. skipped the Master's degree or only has a Master's degree), the undergrad degree is given a more careful looking over. 

There are  a few things that I always tick off from the undergrad degree when I'm performing faculty screenings. These things might not be used much for advanced screenings, but I do document them just in case.
1. Date of completion
2. Specific institution name (this is part of the "reputation" thing)
3. Major and whether or not it is a BA or a BS

[Ruralguy]

I haven't really cared about it in a detailed way, but do make not of whether their undergrad experience was more likely to have been like ours or was in a location like ours. I don't think that really automatically puts anyone on or off the short list per se, but its one of many relatively minor things many of us consider. I'm at a  rural SLAC though, and historically we've had some of the same issued that Polly addressed.

We certainly do not just go by who has the biggest stack of journal articles, or most grant dollars. We're not teaching only, but we can't afford to be star stuck and have the person not able or willing to do the actual job.

[Hibush]

I'm at an R1 now and I don't ever remember the undergrad institution playing a role here or anywhere else I've worked. We want to hire people that are going to do the job.

+1

Having an undergraduate experience that sets you up to do a really spectacular job as a grad student is really helpful. The name of the undergrad institution matters relatively little at that point.  Odds are that certain undergrad institutions are overrepresented on the short list, but that is because they are good at chosing and training students to excel in grad school.