The murder of George Floyd in Minneapolis, MN last Monday, May 25

[Economizer]

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

[evil_physics_witchcraft]

I say decisive leadership needed, justified, and supplied. What
would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income.
Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together. I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

Oh, do you mean the cops?

[Parasaurolophus]

"Where is Joe Biden?" is a very important question, especially given how he tries to portray his relation to the Black community.

As for the rest... damage to human beings matters a lot more than property damage. The pregnant woman in Austin who was shot in the abdomen matters a lot more than any number of shop windows. The numerous protesters and bystanders who have lost eyes to the police matter more than any number of burning cars. And the people the police have murdered in an effort to demonstrate their restraint matter more than any lost income.

It's the cops who are rioting. And there's nobody to keep them in check.

[mamselle]

I was heartened, in the midst of the terrible things reported above, to see this:

   https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2020/06/01/amanpour-houston-art-acevedo-george-floyd.cnn

This is the police chief of Houston, where the Floyd's family still live.

Such a difference.

M.

So far, Flint, Camden, and Houston have shown an alternative path.

I want to see others pick up that trail and follow it.

M.

[Wahoo Redux]

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

And how is this approach working?  Do we see the protests winding down?  What do you think the legacy of a strong-arm approach is going to be?

As several people have pointed out, police walking with protesters works.
Firing on protesters so that Trump can have a photo-shoot does not.

As long as he was taking credit for the economy Obama built, Trump could at least pretend.
In the midst of two ongoing national crises, Trump is a third crisis in the making.

[mahagonny]

I fear and also suspect the two big crises now are going to be to Trump's political advantage. When things are bad a demagogue like him has new opportunities to create villains, build them up. He can become the law and order guy, the guy who was right about the Chinese all along, etc. Hatred is money in the bank of campaigning, for him. He knows how to make it play in his favor, by instinct.

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

And how is this approach working?  Do we see the protests winding down?  What do you think the legacy of a strong-arm approach is going to be?

As several people have pointed out, police walking with protesters works.
Firing on protesters so that Trump can have a photo-shoot does not.

As long as he was taking credit for the economy Obama built, Trump could at least pretend.
In the midst of two ongoing national crises, Trump is a third crisis in the making.

As long as he is appealing to hate, and the more his fans listen to him, the more hate they feel, he can keep momentum. Now he's talking about us being at war.
'No one likes to admit it, but hate is not an unpleasant emotion, and in war time we are encouraged to indulge in an orgy of hate.' Andy Rooney..    Chaos is a place Trump is comfortable. Gets to sound decisive and resolved. People take sides, grey areas recede.

[lightning]

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

Who the f**k cares what Joe Biden would have done. He's not the president. Quit deflecting.
And, no, it's not decisive leadership to hide when the protests/riots are happening.

[lightning]

It looks to me like "reform" has not worked. We've been talking about reform for decades, and yet police still routinely abuse, assault, and murder suspects, especially those of colour. They routinely plant evidence, as we've seen in Baltimore and elsewhere, and still can't interrogate suspects properly, without leading them to false confessions. They can't be trusted to investigate certain kinds of crimes (like sexual assault) or crimes committed against certain kinds of people. And they can't even be trusted to rely on accurate, credible, reliable scientific evidence, as the widespread reliance on forensic odontology, gunshot residue, and lie detectors attest (to say nothing of the problems with fingerprinting, or the widespread assumption that asking for a lawyer indicates guilt or, hell, attempts to deny suspects access to their lawyers).

And then there are the prosecutors, into whose hands plea bargaining has concentrated the powers formerly vested in the judge and jury, who routinely violate Brady by withholding  material and exculpatory evidence, and who enjoy immunity from the law for all of their many misdeeds. And whose case histories are never reviewed after they've been found to habitually violate prosecutorial standards (or the law).

It's all broken, and the time for piecemeal reform has passed. Body cams and implicit bias training simply will not do. You need to disarm regular police, and you need to consistently and systematically prosecute police and prosecutorial misconduct, and make real efforts to stamp it out. And no more of this firing officers only to see them transfer to a department in some other state.

It's popular to attribute such misdeeds to a few bad apples, but people seem to forget the rest of the saying: a few bad apples spoil the bunch. The rot here runs very, very deep, and needs to be systematically extirpated.

Comedian Chris Rock sums it up best:

"Whenever the cops gun down an innocent black man, they always say the same thing: 'Well, it's not most cops. It's just a few bad apples. It's just a few bad apples.'

Bad apple? That's a lovely name for murderer. That almost sounds nice. I've had a bad apple. It was tart, but it didn't choke me out. Here's the thing. Here's the thing. I know being a cop is hard. I know that shit's dangerous. I know it is, okay? But some jobs can't have bad apples.

Some jobs, everybody gotta be good. Like ... pilots. Ya know, American Airlines can't be like, 'Most of our pilots like to land. We just got a few bad apples that like to crash into mountains. Please bear with us.'"

[Treehugger]

I fear and also suspect the two big crises now are going to be to Trump's political advantage. When things are bad a demagogue like him has new opportunities to create villains, build them up. He can become the law and order guy, the guy who was right about the Chinese all along, etc. Hatred is money in the bank of campaigning, for him. He knows how to make it play in his favor, by instinct.

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

And how is this approach working?  Do we see the protests winding down?  What do you think the legacy of a strong-arm approach is going to be?

As several people have pointed out, police walking with protesters works.
Firing on protesters so that Trump can have a photo-shoot does not.

As long as he was taking credit for the economy Obama built, Trump could at least pretend.
In the midst of two ongoing national crises, Trump is a third crisis in the making.

As long as he is appealing to hate, and the more his fans listen to him, the more hate they feel, he can keep momentum. Now he's talking about us being at war.
'No one likes to admit it, but hate is not an unpleasant emotion, and in war time we are encouraged to indulge in an orgy of hate.' Andy Rooney..    Chaos is a place Trump is comfortable. Gets to sound decisive and resolved. People take sides, grey areas recede.

Hmmm. I get why you are concerned. But doesn't a "law and order" platform work if only you are not the incumbent? If everything devolved into chaos on your watch, why would anyone expect anything different during a second term?

[Katrina Gulliver]

Hmmm. I get why you are concerned. But doesn't a "law and order" platform work if only you are not the incumbent? If everything devolved into chaos on your watch, why would anyone expect anything different during a second term?

The tactic I assume would be to pass the blame for riots onto Democrat mayors and governors.

[Cheerful]

Comedian Chris Rock sums it up best:

"Whenever the cops gun down an innocent black man, they always say the same thing: 'Well, it's not most cops. It's just a few bad apples. It's just a few bad apples.'

Bad apple? That's a lovely name for murderer. That almost sounds nice. I've had a bad apple. It was tart, but it didn't choke me out. Here's the thing. Here's the thing. I know being a cop is hard. I know that shit's dangerous. I know it is, okay? But some jobs can't have bad apples.

Some jobs, everybody gotta be good. Like ... pilots. Ya know, American Airlines can't be like, 'Most of our pilots like to land. We just got a few bad apples that like to crash into mountains. Please bear with us.'"

I hadn't heard that, thanks lightning.  Well-stated.  I looked up the quote.  It's from 2018 and Chris also said:  "I don't think they pay cops enough. And you get what you pay for."

Salary structures in the U.S. are bizarre.  It's the same for nursing home workers (and in many other key sectors).  Low salaries and we expect them to do harrowing, difficult, often unpleasant work for our nation's most vulnerable.

Amazing that some fulfill these essential roles in society.  Is there sufficient diversity in the police force?

[mahagonny]

I say decisive leadership is needed, justified, and supplied. What would Joe Biden have done? Thoroughly address the underlying issues or immediately address the life and property concerns of a broad cross section of citizens suffering from the acts of hooligans. Every business does not have insurance coverage for civil unrest. Can they afford even more days of reduced or no income. Can thousands more workers not be able to go to work or have to replace their income stream all together? I am sure that Mr. Biden is a better politician than President Trump but his politics would definitely force him to be "namby-pamby" in such a situation that requires immediate action to protect the large number of metropolitan areas being damaged, and to not allow hostile peoples opportunities to prey on our nation as a whole.

Who the f**k cares what Joe Biden would have done. He's not the president. Quit deflecting.
And, no, it's not decisive leadership to hide when the protests/riots are happening.

I can tell you what he would not have done. Right here. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-trump-police-dont-worry-people-custody-hitting-heads-squad-cars

You can't have a president who rejects the standards of decent treatment of suspects while they're being arrested console or lead a nation through the mess we have now.

As for being a leader during a time of unrest and pain, Biden could try to do it, and he would be equipped with a reputation as a decent person, which Trump is not. But then leading with an iron fist when you have plenty to do it with doesn't require much deftness, and probably some would enjoy seeing it.

[Diogenes]

Comedian Chris Rock sums it up best:

"Whenever the cops gun down an innocent black man, they always say the same thing: 'Well, it's not most cops. It's just a few bad apples. It's just a few bad apples.'

Bad apple? That's a lovely name for murderer. That almost sounds nice. I've had a bad apple. It was tart, but it didn't choke me out. Here's the thing. Here's the thing. I know being a cop is hard. I know that shit's dangerous. I know it is, okay? But some jobs can't have bad apples.

Some jobs, everybody gotta be good. Like ... pilots. Ya know, American Airlines can't be like, 'Most of our pilots like to land. We just got a few bad apples that like to crash into mountains. Please bear with us.'"

I also like John Oliver's point that one Bad Apple is all it takes. We can all guarantee Snow White is never going to eat another apple again.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaD84DTGULo

[Wahoo Redux]

Photo-op: Trump standing with a Bible in his hands with riots across the country because of police brutality, one or four bad apples (you decide), exacerbated by tear-gas and the threat of our own army.

That screams of desperation and stupidity to me.

Please go ahead, explain how this is not something Biden would do.  Maybe blame Obama or Hilary? 

There are all sorts of rhetorical tacks for avoiding the obvious.

[AmLitHist]

Joe delivered a wonderful speech this morning in Philadelphia. 

In StL, a retired black police captain was killed while responding to alarms at a friend's pawn shop as it was being looted.  It was live-streamed on Facebook.

Trump confirms my atheism:  if there's a God, Trump should've been struck down when he ordered the streets cleared so he could get his photo op holding up a Bible in front of the church.