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Dealing with TA that does not care

Started by research_prof, October 30, 2020, 05:41:42 PM

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research_prof

I have a TA for my course that I can tell he does not really care. He is an MS student and is basically getting his entire MS degree for free (and gets paid on top of that) due to the fact that he is a TA for my course. I have had him for 2 semesters now. During the first semester, he was bad and I would have dropped him at the end if COVID was not an issue and I was sure we will have incoming international graduate students, so that I could pick one of them. This semester things started really bad: he was responding to my messages and emails after 2 days, was not responding to students on piazza, etc. So, I basically sent an email to him cc'ing the chair of the department basically telling him that unless he starts behaving more professionally immediately, I will have to terminate his contract.

This worked to some extent and he started being more responsive. However, still his grading work is bad (I always have to correct mistakes he does!) and, in general, I can tell he does not care about doing the job in the right way. My impression is he believes that whatever goes wrong I will be in trouble as the main instructor and he will be fine because he is the TA.

I even started wondering: what's the point of having a TA, if he cannot even grade homeworks and exams properly... My department is especially dysfunctional when it comes to TAs (among many other things...)... I cannot, for example, hire my own PhD student (who is stellar) as the TA for my class.

Have you been in similar situations in the past? Any ideas?

PS: If I decide to not renew his contract, I have to go to graduate studies and explain to them why I am not renewing his contract. Of course, I also need to provide proof that he is not doing the job right. What a waste of money and time...

clean

my experiences were related to my own time as a PhD student. 
I will say that my program was not particularly good at dealing with graduate assistants, especially those from other countries. There was an underground or alternative information network that let those students know what they needed to do to maximize their pay/minimize their work effort.

(One professor remarked that he would like to give his crop of duds  a stick with a nail on the end and have them pick up trash for their stipend if he werent afraid that they end up stabbing themselves in the foot!).

One particular student was passed around from person to person becuase he was particularly worthless.  The last faculty member he was assigned to was told "good luck" by another when he was told about this reassignment.  He made it clear to the department chair that IF the student continued to be a dud that they would swap and the chair would get dud and the faculty member would get the chair's worker (who was particularly good).

In the end, the only 'revenge' was that the dud applied to be admitted to the PhD program.  Dud was accepted with NO funding at all!!

So my only advice is to follow the experience of the last faculty member. Make a deal that you get the 'pick of the litter' from the crop of the decision maker's TAs and Require that the decision maker makes full use of the Dud. 

Make it clear to the Dud that you will not serve as a positive reference and that should anyone ask, you will provide a very factual response. 
"The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am"  Darth Vader

research_prof

Quote from: clean on October 30, 2020, 06:02:14 PM
my experiences were related to my own time as a PhD student. 
I will say that my program was not particularly good at dealing with graduate assistants, especially those from other countries. There was an underground or alternative information network that let those students know what they needed to do to maximize their pay/minimize their work effort.

(One professor remarked that he would like to give his crop of duds  a stick with a nail on the end and have them pick up trash for their stipend if he werent afraid that they end up stabbing themselves in the foot!).

One particular student was passed around from person to person becuase he was particularly worthless.  The last faculty member he was assigned to was told "good luck" by another when he was told about this reassignment.  He made it clear to the department chair that IF the student continued to be a dud that they would swap and the chair would get dud and the faculty member would get the chair's worker (who was particularly good).

In the end, the only 'revenge' was that the dud applied to be admitted to the PhD program.  Dud was accepted with NO funding at all!!

So my only advice is to follow the experience of the last faculty member. Make a deal that you get the 'pick of the litter' from the crop of the decision maker's TAs and Require that the decision maker makes full use of the Dud. 

Make it clear to the Dud that you will not serve as a positive reference and that should anyone ask, you will provide a very factual response.

Oh, yes. I was planning to actually provide a "factual" reference letter if I am asked. I would actually do that without a warning. I would just provide my factual reference letter and then let the potential employer figure things out. I do not think this student will be applying to the PhD program, but rather try to find a job.

The other thing I was thinking about is to not renew his contract at the end of the academic year, go through the trouble with graduate studies, and let him pay the tuition for his final semester.

clean

QuoteThe other thing I was thinking about is to not renew his contract at the end of the academic year, go through the trouble with graduate studies, and let him pay the tuition for his final semester.

IF this is a possibility, I think that it would be appropriate.  In fact, If you can fire him at the end of this term, I would consider that.  I would first go to HR for advice to make sure that you have documented everything so that there is a paper trail that s/he is a dud. 
"The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am"  Darth Vader

research_prof

Quote from: clean on October 30, 2020, 08:10:34 PM
QuoteThe other thing I was thinking about is to not renew his contract at the end of the academic year, go through the trouble with graduate studies, and let him pay the tuition for his final semester.

IF this is a possibility, I think that it would be appropriate.  In fact, If you can fire him at the end of this term, I would consider that.  I would first go to HR for advice to make sure that you have documented everything so that there is a paper trail that s/he is a dud.

I would have fired the TA already but then it would  be up to me to find a new one. If COVID was not a problem and I knew we have a new batch of students coming in, I would have already done that. If I fire this guy, I risk having to deal with the course entirely on my own.

clean

QuoteIf I fire this guy, I risk having to deal with the course entirely on my own.

It sounded like you were in a worse situation than doing it all yourself. NOW you have to fix his/her mistakes.  May you be better off starting the term fresh with a new person, even if that person is YoU?
"The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am"  Darth Vader

polly_mer

What project/program/employee management skills have you tried to get this TA to do what's necessary?

What would you do if this person were part of your research group and needed additional mentoring to bring him up to good?

If I remember correctly, then you're trying to get a TT position at a much more research-active place and away from this teaching place.  Being able to manage underlings who are doing the day-to-day work is an important skill.  This is an opportunity to practice those management skills, which can result in a documented firing, but that's usually not the first step.
Quote from: hmaria1609 on June 27, 2019, 07:07:43 PM
Do whatever you want--I'm just the background dancer in your show!

arcturus

Who is actually paying the salary (and tuition and fees) for this TA? I ask because you may not have the authority to "fire" him either this term or next. In my department, TA's are funded by lines in the departmental budget (i.e., funded by the University) and assigned to assist specific courses by a committee that includes both faculty and student representatives. If a TA is not performing required duties, it falls to the department chair (or the director of graduate studies, if the department chair is conflicted) to work with the student regarding their performance, not the instructor of the course the student is assigned as a TA.

So, have you reported the issues to the appropriate person in your department? If there is no one else to report to, have you consulted with anyone else in your department to see if there are department norms (other than "Suck it up. We have all had bad TAs before.")? Have you inquired as to other people's experience with this student either as a TA or as a research student? Is the student likely to fail out due to lack of progress toward degree, so they will be gone in a semester in any event? It is always difficult to deal with poor performing students who are both students and employees, but the actions required to achieve your desired outcome (no longer have this student as your TA) may differ depending on the student's status as a student. In any event, it is always good to document both the problems and the steps you have taken to address the problems, both for your own sake and for the student.

research_prof

Quote from: polly_mer on October 31, 2020, 08:58:48 AM
What project/program/employee management skills have you tried to get this TA to do what's necessary?

What would you do if this person were part of your research group and needed additional mentoring to bring him up to good?

If I remember correctly, then you're trying to get a TT position at a much more research-active place and away from this teaching place.  Being able to manage underlings who are doing the day-to-day work is an important skill.  This is an opportunity to practice those management skills, which can result in a documented firing, but that's usually not the first step.

The first thing I did is to have an informal chat with the TA. I explained the duties clearly and I asked if he understands them and if he is ok with the. He said "yes". After he started not delivering and responding to my emails after 2 days, I sent him an email where I explained why his behavior is unprofessional and what the expectations are. He agreed in writing too. I asked him to send me weekly reports where he includes the amount of time he spent on each task, if he has any problems/issues, and what he will be doing during the upcoming week. Overall, he has never worked 20 hours weekly over the last 2 months. And that's what he states in his own reports. I clarified to him that his contract requires him to work at least 20 hours per week.

In addition, I started having regular weekly meetings with him (instead of ad-hoc meetings whenever needed) and asked him to attend the weekly meeting of my group. I was hoping that he cannot show up in front of others and basically say "this week, I did not do anything". I was right--this helped a bit. Then, I asked him to watch the recordings of my lectures in case the mistakes he makes while grading are actually related to him not having a good knowledge basis of the actual course (despite having been a TA for it for a semester already). I asked him to hold office hours to have interactions with the students too. Nothing worked.

As I said, this dude just does not care.

research_prof

#9
Quote from: arcturus on October 31, 2020, 09:48:30 AM
Who is actually paying the salary (and tuition and fees) for this TA? I ask because you may not have the authority to "fire" him either this term or next. In my department, TA's are funded by lines in the departmental budget (i.e., funded by the University) and assigned to assist specific courses by a committee that includes both faculty and student representatives. If a TA is not performing required duties, it falls to the department chair (or the director of graduate studies, if the department chair is conflicted) to work with the student regarding their performance, not the instructor of the course the student is assigned as a TA.

So, have you reported the issues to the appropriate person in your department? If there is no one else to report to, have you consulted with anyone else in your department to see if there are department norms (other than "Suck it up. We have all had bad TAs before.")? Have you inquired as to other people's experience with this student either as a TA or as a research student? Is the student likely to fail out due to lack of progress toward degree, so they will be gone in a semester in any event? It is always difficult to deal with poor performing students who are both students and employees, but the actions required to achieve your desired outcome (no longer have this student as your TA) may differ depending on the student's status as a student. In any event, it is always good to document both the problems and the steps you have taken to address the problems, both for your own sake and for the student.

Right. He is paid through the department. I have talked to the department chair who basically does not care either and he told me "this student is assigned to you. You can fire him if you want". This, of course, is not true--I have to go to HR and graduate studies and justify why I am firing this student, but, as usual, administrators like painting a rosy picture (or at least this is what they do in my college).

research_prof

Quote from: clean on October 31, 2020, 08:42:16 AM
QuoteIf I fire this guy, I risk having to deal with the course entirely on my own.

It sounded like you were in a worse situation than doing it all yourself. NOW you have to fix his/her mistakes.  May you be better off starting the term fresh with a new person, even if that person is YoU?

I am not sure if the TA is actually saving me any time at this point. But I need to think a bit to respond to that.