2020 Elections

[writingprof]

The American "taxophobia" is part of the general paranoia about government, which is a particular
American obsession.

I see we've begun making lists of things we're thankful for.  I'm with you.

Wanting the death of something or someone is hatred.

So much agreement!  The Left's decade-old obsession with white demographic collapse is indeed hatred.

[mamselle]

You're really misinterpreting a desire to see collegial expansion and inclusion as a collapse of something that doesn't exist to begin with.

"White demographic collapse" presumes a white demographic as a rarified homogenous entity.

Nowhere on the planet has there ever only been a fully, exclusively white population that existed without members of other races (often propping it up).

Recognizing that fact is not hatred of whites, it's celebrating the fact that people can get together and create something larger than any of them.

I'm white, my prayer partner is black. Neither of us hates the other; we pray with and for each other all the time. I learn and teach dance and music from Asian, South American, African and various European sources--the cultures that gave birth to those dances rejoice in their being shared. I read articles and look at visual sources from all over the world--the verbal texts in translation if I must, or in the original language if I can. 

If I limited myself to only white-produced cultural materials, or tried to understand, say, only the gravestones in a nearby burying ground that has two stones and two more (possibly four more) burials of Blacks from the same era, I'd be misrepresenting the historical record (as it is, the site misrepresents its own setting: there were probably 20+ Blacks in town at any one time--something I've called attention to in every tour and talk I've done since 1978).

Two of those blacks were soldiers in the colonial militia that defended the birth of your freedoms. Shall I leave them out to assuage your white-manque sense of grievance? Or would you just rather they hadn't seen fit to die on your behalf, as well as that of others, including the 100 or so freed Blacks living in a part of the town on the other side of the river?

Your distinctions in this dimension make no sense to me.

M.

[writingprof]

While I appreciate your careful reasoning, I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

Wanting a particular race to decrease so that another can increase is obviously racist, which was my argument from the beginning.

Anti-white racism is central to Democratic politics. 

[mamselle]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

[mahagonny]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

...and the media decide what exists and what doesn't, don't they.

Megan Kelly explains why the press and academia live in the same bubble. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdWw_yGbvBs

[mamselle]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

...and the media decide what exists and what doesn't, don't they.

Megan Kelly explains why the press and academia live in the same bubble. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdWw_yGbvBs

Megan Kelly --Do you mean Megyn Kelly?

First rule in journalism: spell their names right.

M

[writingprof]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

Are you ignorant or full of s--t?  I would lean toward the latter, but the gemstone purity of your tone-deafness ("And I've written for the media") is such that the former must also be considered.  You've "written" for "the media"?  Congratulations.  So has the guy who leaks celebrity nudes and includes a caption.  That you seem not to know that the gatekeeper system no longer exists is certainly in keeping with your (alleged) unfamiliarity with a major plotline in electoral analysis for at least the last three cycles.  So, points for consistency, I guess.

[Sun_Worshiper]

Minority voters voting republican more often is a good thing. It puts more diversity in their population. Diversity, do we remember that idea?

Both parties should be trying to get black votes and blacks should have real reasons to choose either one over the other.

It would be a healthier democracy if both parties attracted minority voters. But it is up to GOP to earn minority votes and part of doing that will require them to disavow and eliminate the racisms that is central to their politics.

Another Nostradamus

Democrats were, once again, astonished to find (1) the expected blue wave never came and (2) although Trump lost, he almost didn't, and (3) the party continues to make progress with minority votes.

Not sure what this has to do with my comment. But in general GOP/Trump did not do well with minorities and in fact Black turnout in a few key cities was key to his defeat.

[mahagonny]

Minority voters voting republican more often is a good thing. It puts more diversity in their population. Diversity, do we remember that idea?

Both parties should be trying to get black votes and blacks should have real reasons to choose either one over the other.

It would be a healthier democracy if both parties attracted minority voters. But it is up to GOP to earn minority votes and part of doing that will require them to disavow and eliminate the racisms that is central to their politics.

Another Nostradamus

Democrats were, once again, astonished to find (1) the expected blue wave never came and (2) although Trump lost, he almost didn't, and (3) the party continues to make progress with minority votes.

Not sure what this has to do with my comment. But in general GOP/Trump did not do well with minorities and in fact Black turnout in a few key cities was key to his defeat.

I believe the arithmetic problem is this: if only 8% of black people who vote vote for Trump, then a high turnout of black voters is good for Biden. Stacey Abrams and some others probably accomplished a lot in getting voters in her region registered and to the polls. Which is legal, and good for democracy, I guess. It's legitimate, not cheating or fraud. But having increasing proportions of minority votes go to the candidate who has been consistently lampooned as the 'racist' 'xenophobe' etc. is something the democrats cannot figure out, and particularly when individual minorities identify reasons for choosing Trump that actually, broadside, defy the left's characterization of him and his aims point by point.
They couldn't figure out Bush over Kerry in 2004, or Trump over Clinton in 2016 either.
The 'Nostradamus' wisecrack meant I include you in the group of left leaning academics who think you have your finger on the pulse of the American electorate, but keep getting surprised by what happens.
And in fact, one forumite revealed in a moment of candor recently that's it's not important to him to persuade others of his worldview, fervent though he is in holding it, because he doesn't run for office. He has tenure. And I think that anecdote is a piece of what's going on.
Jimmy Carter said in 2016 'both candidates this time are unpopular, but of the two I'll vote for Hillary.' He had a better idea what was going on than this forum did.

[Chris J]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

Are you ignorant or full of s--t?  I would lean toward the latter, but the gemstone purity of your tone-deafness ("And I've written for the media") is such that the former must also be considered.  You've "written" for "the media"?  Congratulations.  So has the guy who leaks celebrity nudes and includes a caption.  That you seem not to know that the gatekeeper system no longer exists is certainly in keeping with your (alleged) unfamiliarity with a major plotline in electoral analysis for at least the last three cycles.  So, points for consistency, I guess.

Writingprof, you should apologize for this objectionable opening question to Mamselle. Do you speak that way IRL to your colleagues and students? Or only here anonymously?

[Sun_Worshiper]

Minority voters voting republican more often is a good thing. It puts more diversity in their population. Diversity, do we remember that idea?

Both parties should be trying to get black votes and blacks should have real reasons to choose either one over the other.

It would be a healthier democracy if both parties attracted minority voters. But it is up to GOP to earn minority votes and part of doing that will require them to disavow and eliminate the racisms that is central to their politics.

Another Nostradamus

Democrats were, once again, astonished to find (1) the expected blue wave never came and (2) although Trump lost, he almost didn't, and (3) the party continues to make progress with minority votes.

Not sure what this has to do with my comment. But in general GOP/Trump did not do well with minorities and in fact Black turnout in a few key cities was key to his defeat.

I believe the arithmetic problem is this: if only 8% of black people who vote vote for Trump, then a high turnout of black voters is good for Biden. Stacey Abrams and some others probably accomplished a lot in getting voters in her region registered and to the polls. Which is legal, and good for democracy, I guess. It's legitimate, not cheating or fraud. But having increasing proportions of minority votes go to the candidate who has been consistently lampooned as the 'racist' 'xenophobe' etc. is something the democrats cannot figure out, and particularly when individual minorities identify reasons for choosing Trump that actually, broadside, defy the left's characterization of him and his aims point by point.
They couldn't figure out Bush over Kerry in 2004, or Trump over Clinton in 2016 either.
The 'Nostradamus' wisecrack meant I include you in the group of left leaning academics who think you have your finger on the pulse of the American electorate, but keep getting surprised by what happens.
And in fact, one forumite revealed in a moment of candor recently that's it's not important to him to persuade others of his worldview, fervent though he is in holding it, because he doesn't run for office. He has tenure. And I think that anecdote is a piece of what's going on.

Trump is "lampooned" as racist because he says racist things frequently (e.g. his birtherism, his calls for minorities born in America to go back to their countries, his statement that there are good people on both sides of the racist vs. anti-racist movements). Minorities voted for him in small numbers despite that. There are various hypotheses about why that is, but I wouldn't call it a mystery, just something that will require data collection and analysis to clarify. I also wouldn't put much stock in some youtube video by an individual black person.

As for the Nostradamus crack, I wasn't surprised by what happened. I thought Trump would probably lose, and he did. I thought Trump might win Florida, which would drag out the relevant counting, and that is what happened. I thought the Democrats had about a 50/50 chance of winning the Senate, and that was about right. Look at my posts throughout this thread and you'll see that I based most of my takes on the election on the polling, with an understanding for polling errors.

[writingprof]

I fear that you're willfully ignoring my point, which is that Democrats and their media allies have been gleefully riding the "demography is destiny" train for twenty years.  They want white people to age out and die so that the "coalition of the ascendant" can rule the country.  Surely you don't deny the existence of this phenomenon.

First I've heard of it.

And I've written for the media.

M.

Are you ignorant or full of s--t?  I would lean toward the latter, but the gemstone purity of your tone-deafness ("And I've written for the media") is such that the former must also be considered.  You've "written" for "the media"?  Congratulations.  So has the guy who leaks celebrity nudes and includes a caption.  That you seem not to know that the gatekeeper system no longer exists is certainly in keeping with your (alleged) unfamiliarity with a major plotline in electoral analysis for at least the last three cycles.  So, points for consistency, I guess.

Writingprof, you should apologize for this objectionable opening question to Mamselle. Do you speak that way IRL to your colleagues and students? Or only here anonymously?

Only here, anonymously.  But, you know, I think you're on to something with your insightful realization that real-life and anonymous-message-board etiquettes differ.  Have you considered writing that up for publication?

[mahagonny]

that there are good people on both sides of the racist vs. anti-racist movements

As far as I'm aware, the most condoning thing Trump has said about racist movements is 'I don't know these people you're asking me about.' In the brouhaha over the confederate statues he was taken out of context.

I didn't vote for Trump. I think the birtherism thing was an embarrassment.

If he is racist for courting votes of people who are considered racist, that's potentially very concerning; on the other hand, if your idea of a hard core racist voter includes people like Larry Elder or Pat Buchanan, once again, you're not getting it.
At the same time, democrats do not mind when ignorant people vote for them.

He has often said 'I'm the least racist person you'll meet' which is off putting by being boastful, but the stated intent to be a non-racist presence has not been approached with good faith.
I hope you don't start with the 'wanting to make a dent in illegal immigration is racist' thing that they all do.

[Sun_Worshiper]

that there are good people on both sides of the racist vs. anti-racist movements

As far as I'm aware, the most condoning thing Trump has said about racist movements is 'I don't know these people you're asking me about.' In the brouhaha over the confederate statues he was taken out of context.

I didn't vote for Trump. I think the birtherism thing was an embarrassment.

He has often said 'I'm the least racist person you'll meet' which is off putting by being boastful, but the stated intent to be a non-racist presence has not been approached with good faith.
I hope you don't start with the 'wanting to make a dent in illegal immigration is racist' thing that they all do.

Trump has gone out of his way to court racists and to stoke racism in the electorate. He has said any number of hateful things about individual minorities and about minority groups. Even if one or two of his comments were taken out of context by the media, there are plenty of other examples of racism from Trump, including Birtherism, which is a racist conspiracy theory that only an idiot would believe, and his calls for minority members of the "Squad" to go back to their countries.

[mahagonny]

that there are good people on both sides of the racist vs. anti-racist movements

As far as I'm aware, the most condoning thing Trump has said about racist movements is 'I don't know these people you're asking me about.' In the brouhaha over the confederate statues he was taken out of context.

I didn't vote for Trump. I think the birtherism thing was an embarrassment.

He has often said 'I'm the least racist person you'll meet' which is off putting by being boastful, but the stated intent to be a non-racist presence has not been approached with good faith.
I hope you don't start with the 'wanting to make a dent in illegal immigration is racist' thing that they all do.

Trump has gone out of his way to court racists and to stoke racism in the electorate. He has said any number of hateful things about individual minorities and about minority groups. Even if one or two of his comments were taken out of context by the media, there are plenty of other examples of racism from Trump, including Birtherism, which is a racist conspiracy theory that only an idiot would believe, and his calls for minority members of the "Squad" to go back to their countries.

Trump's rudeness has so many targets that it's not racism that jumps out at me. More like a propensity for antagonistic speech that's as ready to go as budweiser on tap at an 1970's sports bar.
The 'squad' going away would be good for the democrats' future I believe (as long as we can all get into the telling-the-future business with no penalty other than embarrassment later.)