Cake, Pie, and Related Questions

[RatGuy]

Krispy Kreme is selling Mars donuts today. And if you've got your Mars Rover boarding pass, you get a Mars donut for free!

[mamselle]

Our area ousted KK in favor of DD.....so, this may be a regional thing...!!

(But still good to know for those who can take advantage of it)

In other news: This recipe for Blackberry cobbler appeared in my newsfeed this AM.
         It seems to read my mind, sometimes, although I know it's just algorithms:

   https://www.mashed.com/334375/blackberry-cobbler-recipe/

One place where I lived and was allowed to grow stuff had blackberry bushes all across the back of the yard...great for pancakes, too; I'd just go pick a few in the AM and mix them into the pancake batter or smush them in with the syrup before heating it up...also good in crepes!

Might have to make a cobbler soon...

Enjoy!

M.

[polly_mer]

This is an ecumenical thread meant to uplift commonalities--disparagements not required to participate...

So people who are just wrong are allowed (even encouraged) to spread their wrongness?  No.

Has anyone ever made or had a Cornish pasty?

If you were from the right part of the Midwest, then you would have had these all the time as a child.  They aren't pies, though, any more than pot pies are pies, but they are very good and I've seldom have a bad one.

[cathwen]

One of my favorite cakes is the Reine de Saba from Julia Child's Mastering the Art of French Cooking (chocolate almond rum [or coffee] cake).  It is easy, and it is delicious.  The frosting is nothing but butter, chocolate, and a flavoring--rum or coffee are suggested.  (I usually choose coffee.).

As for pies, my favorite is apple, but really, I would not turn down almost any kind of fruit pie.  My husband prefers Key lime and lemon meringue with graham cracker crusts. 

[ergative]

Oh, gosh, key lime pie with whipped cream is the best!

I will not make meringues after a traumatic experience that required me to toss an entire chocolate coconut cream pie after the meringue peed all over it.

[ab_grp]

Sorry if I missed it earlier in the thread, but my husband has had good results with a pie crust he makes using vodka (Cook's Illustrated, I think). 

[Puget]

For pie, learn to make a crust with lard (or shortening for the true vegetarians out there).  All-butter pie crusts are so fussy to make.  To get a butter flavor, simply dot the filling with butter before adding the top crust!

I've been getting great results with a basic pie crust recipe from Joy of Cooking.  I use half shortening and half butter.  (Due to family food allergies, I've never tried cooking with lard.)

I also substitute butter for all the shortening when making cake recipes that call for shortening.  It turns out well.

I got terrible results from that pie crust recipe. I later learned that I wasn't using nearly enough butter or water. Maybe my one-cup measure was too big? Something was off about the proportions, anyway, and when I first started I didn't know what sort of consistency to look for, which meant that following the recipe exactly left me with a crumbly mess that didn't roll out, and I was too ignorant to do things like add more water until it cohered.

Now I'm less stingy with both butter and water and it works well. I've found that Melissa Clarke's pie crust recipe on the NYTimes cooking is pretty good, although that has too much butter (like, 10 Tbsp for one cup of flour or so) and tends to drip on the oven floor. The best amount of butter, I've found, is enough so that if you cook your crust in a transparent (e.g., pyrex) pie plate, you can see it bubbling away at the bottom and up the sides, sort of deep-frying in butter the crust dough, but not so much that it bubbles over.

I'm also having good results from freezing + grating the butter, so I don't have to spend ages rubbing/cutting it into the flour.

The easiest way is to roughly chop the butter then pulse it in a food processor with part of the flour.

I do find that most crust recipes call for too little water, though they generally do say to add more as needed. It does really depend on how dry your flour is though -- when I lived in Colorado with often under 10% humidity everything involving flour needed more liquid than called for.

[ergative]

For pie, learn to make a crust with lard (or shortening for the true vegetarians out there).  All-butter pie crusts are so fussy to make.  To get a butter flavor, simply dot the filling with butter before adding the top crust!

I've been getting great results with a basic pie crust recipe from Joy of Cooking.  I use half shortening and half butter.  (Due to family food allergies, I've never tried cooking with lard.)

I also substitute butter for all the shortening when making cake recipes that call for shortening.  It turns out well.

I got terrible results from that pie crust recipe. I later learned that I wasn't using nearly enough butter or water. Maybe my one-cup measure was too big? Something was off about the proportions, anyway, and when I first started I didn't know what sort of consistency to look for, which meant that following the recipe exactly left me with a crumbly mess that didn't roll out, and I was too ignorant to do things like add more water until it cohered.

Now I'm less stingy with both butter and water and it works well. I've found that Melissa Clarke's pie crust recipe on the NYTimes cooking is pretty good, although that has too much butter (like, 10 Tbsp for one cup of flour or so) and tends to drip on the oven floor. The best amount of butter, I've found, is enough so that if you cook your crust in a transparent (e.g., pyrex) pie plate, you can see it bubbling away at the bottom and up the sides, sort of deep-frying in butter the crust dough, but not so much that it bubbles over.

I'm also having good results from freezing + grating the butter, so I don't have to spend ages rubbing/cutting it into the flour.

The easiest way is to roughly chop the butter then pulse it in a food processor with part of the flour.

I do find that most crust recipes call for too little water, though they generally do say to add more as needed. It does really depend on how dry your flour is though -- when I lived in Colorado with often under 10% humidity everything involving flour needed more liquid than called for.

I have a coupon that becomes active March first, which I plan to use on a new food processor! (The old one died; it was small and cheap, but served its purpose sufficiently well to educate us that food processors are awesome).

[Stockmann]

Has anyone ever made or had a Cornish pasty?

I've never gotten all the way to Cornwall, nor found them in shops in London, Salisbury, Worcester or Hereford...

So, I'm curious about those, too.

M.

I've had a Cornish pasty in deepest, darkest Cornwall. It was definitely nice but I must admit the best pasties I've had, for my taste, weren't in the UK, or even in a Commonwealth country, but in central-ish Mexico of all places. Specifically, spicy-beans-and-chorizo pasties.

This thread is making me crave pies. I'm less a of a fan of cake, but I'm also craving an orange and yoghurt cake that I've made a couple of times (my mother's recipe). I should try my hand at shepherd's pie or some other savory pie. Or blueberry pie. Pastries have never been my strong suit, although I've baked good-tasting croissants my pastries tend not to look very appetizing.

[Harlow2]

Rhubarb pie! Cherry! And apple, though there's a distressing amount of tasteless apple pie out there.  And why is shortening called that?

Vegetable shortening/Crisco is called shortening because it is similar to lard (the original go-to for bakers) in that it's solid at room temperature and gives a crumbly or "short" texture to baked goods.  Fat is supposed to interfere with gluten cross-linking formation.  Long gluten strands give the stretch or bounce and sturdiness to pasta & bread.  Lack of these cross-links gives the crumbly or soft texture in cookies and pie crust.  Of course, you can over-mix a pie crust and that will encourage more cross-linking and your pie crust will be tough.

If I remember correctly, the original hydrogenated vegetable oil was marketed as an ingredient for soap-making, not for cooking.

That answers my question! And also explains why my pie crusts aren't soft.

[Liquidambar]

For pie, learn to make a crust with lard (or shortening for the true vegetarians out there).  All-butter pie crusts are so fussy to make.  To get a butter flavor, simply dot the filling with butter before adding the top crust!

I've been getting great results with a basic pie crust recipe from Joy of Cooking.  I use half shortening and half butter.  (Due to family food allergies, I've never tried cooking with lard.)

I also substitute butter for all the shortening when making cake recipes that call for shortening.  It turns out well.

I got terrible results from that pie crust recipe. I later learned that I wasn't using nearly enough butter or water. Maybe my one-cup measure was too big? Something was off about the proportions, anyway, and when I first started I didn't know what sort of consistency to look for, which meant that following the recipe exactly left me with a crumbly mess that didn't roll out, and I was too ignorant to do things like add more water until it cohered.

Now I'm less stingy with both butter and water and it works well. I've found that Melissa Clarke's pie crust recipe on the NYTimes cooking is pretty good, although that has too much butter (like, 10 Tbsp for one cup of flour or so) and tends to drip on the oven floor. The best amount of butter, I've found, is enough so that if you cook your crust in a transparent (e.g., pyrex) pie plate, you can see it bubbling away at the bottom and up the sides, sort of deep-frying in butter the crust dough, but not so much that it bubbles over.

I'm also having good results from freezing + grating the butter, so I don't have to spend ages rubbing/cutting it into the flour.

That's the problem with pie crusts, in contrast to other desserts.  Until you've seen how the texture is supposed to look, following a recipe will only get you so far.  I think cakes are much easier to make from a recipe.

I use a pastry cutter similar to this one to incorporate the fats into the flour.  I'm too lazy to grate the butter or haul out my food processor.

I tend to make more cakes than pies since I do a better job on cakes.  This thread is making me crave pie, though.  I kind of want to make a pecan pie, but I'd have to eat the entire thing myself since Liquidspouse is off sweets for Lent.

[Puget]

Rhubarb pie! Cherry! And apple, though there's a distressing amount of tasteless apple pie out there.  And why is shortening called that?

Vegetable shortening/Crisco is called shortening because it is similar to lard (the original go-to for bakers) in that it's solid at room temperature and gives a crumbly or "short" texture to baked goods.  Fat is supposed to interfere with gluten cross-linking formation.  Long gluten strands give the stretch or bounce and sturdiness to pasta & bread.  Lack of these cross-links gives the crumbly or soft texture in cookies and pie crust.  Of course, you can over-mix a pie crust and that will encourage more cross-linking and your pie crust will be tough.

If I remember correctly, the original hydrogenated vegetable oil was marketed as an ingredient for soap-making, not for cooking.

That answers my question! And also explains why my pie crusts aren't soft.

Personally I prefer an all butter crust. It is a bit trickier to work with, but worth it. You really just have to treat it gently, mixing just until it forms a ball (no kneading!), then chill before rolling. It also helps to use pastry flour (which is lower protein than "all purpose") if possible-- I like whole wheat pastry flour, which also gives the crust a nice slightly nutty/toasty flavor.

[ergative]

Rhubarb pie! Cherry! And apple, though there's a distressing amount of tasteless apple pie out there.  And why is shortening called that?

Vegetable shortening/Crisco is called shortening because it is similar to lard (the original go-to for bakers) in that it's solid at room temperature and gives a crumbly or "short" texture to baked goods.  Fat is supposed to interfere with gluten cross-linking formation.  Long gluten strands give the stretch or bounce and sturdiness to pasta & bread.  Lack of these cross-links gives the crumbly or soft texture in cookies and pie crust.  Of course, you can over-mix a pie crust and that will encourage more cross-linking and your pie crust will be tough.

If I remember correctly, the original hydrogenated vegetable oil was marketed as an ingredient for soap-making, not for cooking.

That answers my question! And also explains why my pie crusts aren't soft.

Personally I prefer an all butter crust. It is a bit trickier to work with, but worth it. You really just have to treat it gently, mixing just until it forms a ball (no kneading!), then chill before rolling. It also helps to use pastry flour (which is lower protein than "all purpose") if possible-- I like whole wheat pastry flour, which also gives the crust a nice slightly nutty/toasty flavor.

Oooh, pastry flour! I hadn't thought of that. I have both white and whole wheat pastry flour, so maybe I'll give that a try.

Liquidambar, I have two pastry cutters, but I find that using them is more work than grating frozen butter--especially since my butter lives in the freezer anyway.

I want us to have a fete in which we all bring our pie crusts and compare!

[mamselle]

Meet-up!

Some day, far in the future....

OK, where can we book it with enough space for all the tables it'll take to show off all our baked wares?

(I immediately thought of the permanent Farm Produce barn at the Ohio State Fairgrounds, where I was raised, in Col's, OH...other suggestions? )

And...ummm....Covid permitting, when? (A year from now, in the spring?)

M.

[mamselle]

Apologies for the double-post, but just saw this recipe for biscuit peach cobbler:

   https://buythiscookthat.com/biscuit-peach-cobbler/

The title says it's a "real Southern thing," but...is that true?

And if so, or if not, how or why?

Inquiring minds want to know!

M.