Colleges in Dire Financial Straits

[spork]

College of Saint Rose had negative net revenue for every fiscal year from 2014 to 2019 except for 2018. I suspect Saint Rose was also in deficit for FY 2020 and will be in deficit for FY 2021.

[Hibush]

Did The College of St. Rose in Albany make it to the thread?  I went back to see and couldn't find it.  They are cutting a boat load of programs/TT jobs.  One wonders what the end game is here.

They came up in that they cut 14 tenured faculty in 2015, and also last year in how they could possibly compete for chem majors with superior and cheaper options in the same town.

In this list I notice accounting and auditing. Given the amount of fiscal mismanagement by organizations public and private in the greater Albany area, this major should be in high demand and be valuable for society. OTOH, accounting faculty are among the most expensive.

In terms of end game, I think spork is marveling that they still exist despite all the evidence that they should have closed. Is the end game going to be a real-estate transaction?

[TreadingLife]

More data for the data lovers.
https://www.highereddatastories.com/2021/01/private-college-and-university-tuition.html

This is a deep dive on discount rates, enrollment, and net tuition trends for different types of institutions. Scroll to the middle of the page to see the nice graphics.

There is also a single institution drop down option that has a ton of data for three year increments.

[spork]

Jon Boeckenstedt does very good work.

[spork]

Concordia College NY is dead: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/01/29/concordia-college-new-york-will-close-summer-iona-college-purchase-campus.

[polly_mer]

The problem with undergrad geology in general is similar to the problem with undergrad physics in general: the basic knowledge alone is insufficient, especially when the curriculum at the tiny program is little changed from 30 years ago.  The divide isn't pure versus applied science as mamselle suggests; that's the difference between science and engineering and we do need both.

A good current undergrad program will have internships, coops, undergrad research opportunities, etc. as an integral part of the curriculum for everyone enrolled.  The programs will have good relationships with international companies as part of their pipelines.  For example, the New Mexico Tech geosciences department is small, but the main players in geoscience knowledge recruit and hire their students.  People who know hire from the handful of peer programs and usually the novices with whom their company has been working or others in the professional network who can recommend experienced individuals.

Having a degree in the relevant field without the relevant experience is worse for initial career prospects in the field than having a less related degree, but more experience in a relevant business/site/lab setting.  Mere academic education loses to experience every time, especially in crowded fields where many people will have related enough degrees and related enough experience.

One way the tiny programs in science do a disservice to their students is focusing on textbooks and formal instruction without the experience in working ill-defined problems where no one knows the answers and teamwork is the only path forward.

[apl68]

Concordia College NY is dead: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/01/29/concordia-college-new-york-will-close-summer-iona-college-purchase-campus.

At least they are shutting it down in an orderly manner, and not leaving students in the lurch.

I had never realized that Concordia was a kind of "brand name" for Lutheran schools around the country.  There were 10 at the beginning of the last decade.  Now there are only six.  Wonder whether they can preserve those?

This quote puzzled me a bit:

"Concordia's student body is 42 percent white, 17 percent Hispanic or Latino, 11 percent Black or African American and 5 percent Asian, according to the National Center for Education Statistics."


So...what are the other 25% of their students?  Are the other 25% just not there?  That would help to explain why they're closing....

[marshwiggle]

This quote puzzled me a bit:

"Concordia's student body is 42 percent white, 17 percent Hispanic or Latino, 11 percent Black or African American and 5 percent Asian, according to the National Center for Education Statistics."


So...what are the other 25% of their students?  Are the other 25% just not there?  That would help to explain why they're closing....

Maybe just not interested in identity politics at all, so not "identifying" as anything?

[namazu]

This quote puzzled me a bit:

"Concordia's student body is 42 percent white, 17 percent Hispanic or Latino, 11 percent Black or African American and 5 percent Asian, according to the National Center for Education Statistics."


So...what are the other 25% of their students?  Are the other 25% just not there?  That would help to explain why they're closing....

Maybe just not interested in identity politics at all, so not "identifying" as anything?

International students aren't counted in these stats.  I don't know if they make up a quarter of the student body at Concordia, though.

[polly_mer]

So, if people perceive value in studying something, there are lots of ways they can do it that are not economically difficult for the institution. (Since the enrollment for my elective courses is high enough, they pay for themselves, so they're not in danger of being cancelled.)

Those classes don't pay for themselves if they are not bringing additional enrollment to the institution.  The huge gen ed courses mentioned upthread are irrelevant to the enrollment side of revenue calculations.

Students choose colleges based on various factors including major, location, amenities, mission, and money out of pocket.  A student may choose a S(mall)LAC for class size or a S(elective)LAC for the true liberal arts experience of 1/3 major, 1/3 gen ed, and 1/3 free electives.  However, within rounding of no one enrolls in a given place as a full-time, degree-seeking student for one or two specific courses taught by contingent faculty. 

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/01/19/petition-calls-stanford-reverse-cuts-cantonese-language-program comes immediately to mind as an example of the thinking that ignores the reality of enrollment.  31 people per term taking a low-credit conversational elective is not driving enrollment in the Stanford East Asian studies department.  The assertion that students were picking Stanford in part because of Cantonese courses only matters if Stanford is short on other highly qualified applicants and there's somewhere else offering plenty of relevant seats (unlikely with under 300 people total taking Cantonese courses in the US each year).

A given institution may be losing out on students by having too few interesting electives and no popular majors to regional comprehensive with a bigger variety of majors, courses, and amenities, but the big draw for full-time, degree-seeking enrollees isn't any one gen ed course, even if the university has Stephen King teaching a writing course or Yo-Yo Ma teaching music appreciation.

[polly_mer]

I had never realized that Concordia was a kind of "brand name" for Lutheran schools around the country.  There were 10 at the beginning of the last decade.  Now there are only six.  Wonder whether they can preserve those?

Where do you get six?  https://lutherancolleges.org/our-colleges/ lists 38 institutions.

Bethany College has had financial problems enough that my MIL asked me pointed questions as part of being an officer representative  to the national church conference.  In 2017, Bethany was on probation with the HLC for planning and institutional research along with concerns related to finances https://www.hlcommission.org/?option=com_directory&Action=ShowBasic&instid=1269 . I know individuals at Bethany College and have given them the red flags warnings suggesting they apply out.

[namazu]

I had never realized that Concordia was a kind of "brand name" for Lutheran schools around the country.  There were 10 at the beginning of the last decade.  Now there are only six.  Wonder whether they can preserve those?

Where do you get six?  https://lutherancolleges.org/our-colleges/ lists 38 institutions.

I think apl68 is talking only about those called "Concordia".  But there are still 10 on that list.

[polly_mer]

I had never realized that Concordia was a kind of "brand name" for Lutheran schools around the country.  There were 10 at the beginning of the last decade.  Now there are only six.  Wonder whether they can preserve those?

Where do you get six?  https://lutherancolleges.org/our-colleges/ lists 38 institutions.

I think apl68 is talking only about those called "Concordia".  But there are still 10 on that list.

Ah.  Yeah, the franchises aren't all going to survive since that's not an enrollment-driving brand name, even within the Lutheran communities.

Several of the names on the list of 38 are good enough regional brand names, have an established mission, and aren't enrollment driven to the point that a few late payers endanger next week's payroll.  I expect them to survive.  I don't put Bethany College in the surviving category, but I do put Augusta IL and St. Olaf's College in the surviving category.

[marshwiggle]

So, if people perceive value in studying something, there are lots of ways they can do it that are not economically difficult for the institution. (Since the enrollment for my elective courses is high enough, they pay for themselves, so they're not in danger of being cancelled.)

Those classes don't pay for themselves if they are not bringing additional enrollment to the institution.  The huge gen ed courses mentioned upthread are irrelevant to the enrollment side of revenue calculations.


A given institution may be losing out on students by having too few interesting electives and no popular majors to regional comprehensive with a bigger variety of majors, courses, and amenities, but the big draw for full-time, degree-seeking enrollees isn't any one gen ed course, even if the university has Stephen King teaching a writing course or Yo-Yo Ma teaching music appreciation.

Yes, that's the context of my courses; as interesting electives for a major with lots of students. If an insitution had a reasonable number of English majors, being able to offer the Stephen King writing course would certainly help to solidify their appeal, especially if he would teach the course for the normal single course rate.

[polly_mer]

So, if people perceive value in studying something, there are lots of ways they can do it that are not economically difficult for the institution. (Since the enrollment for my elective courses is high enough, they pay for themselves, so they're not in danger of being cancelled.)

Those classes don't pay for themselves if they are not bringing additional enrollment to the institution.  The huge gen ed courses mentioned upthread are irrelevant to the enrollment side of revenue calculations.


A given institution may be losing out on students by having too few interesting electives and no popular majors to regional comprehensive with a bigger variety of majors, courses, and amenities, but the big draw for full-time, degree-seeking enrollees isn't any one gen ed course, even if the university has Stephen King teaching a writing course or Yo-Yo Ma teaching music appreciation.

Yes, that's the context of my courses; as interesting electives for a major with lots of students. If an insitution had a reasonable number of English majors, being able to offer the Stephen King writing course would certainly help to solidify their appeal, especially if he would teach the course for the normal single course rate.

The catch is already having a sufficient number of majors.  Electives mostly matter by their absence.  No or few electives is very bad.  However, what the specific electives are is usually not a driver for enrollment. 

The annual Stephen King workshop (capped at 15 students) alone is worthless in terms of attracting fulltime, enrolled majors.

The annual Stephen King workshop being on a list of 10- 20 such workshops offered every year a!omg with excellent fulltime faculty to have 20 great electives every term in a curriculum with room for electives may be a great program.  However, any one offering matters much less to overall student enrollment than the overall experience of being in a fabulous program.

Your electives, no matter how fabulous, are not driving enrollment of the relevant majors to your institution.  Those courses don't pay for themselves, but are worth running to contribute to the overall student experience.