Cancelling Dr. Seuss

[Wahoo Redux]

Lotsa stuff here, so random responsa and observations in no necessary particular order of  importance:

1) 'classical' means different things... most of the schools in the 'classical' and especially the 'classical Christian' k12 school orbit do not really consider the Renaissance, and esp Renaissance art, the sort of 'classical' stuff they are emphasizing.  Some do not even do much art at all.   They rather consider things like ancient language study, rhetoric, logic, and the medieval Trivium to be of much greater import. 

2) I get that Michelangelo is not some scumbag perv on the net proffering kiddie porn.  Obviously.   That said, exactly what educational objective would be furthered by showing prepubescent children art that depicts full-on nudity in people, esp children?   There certainly is no tradition amongst evangelical protestantism for showing such images, or even for artists within these movements, for making them.

Here is a link to an overview of the Hillsdale 5th grade curriculum. For art, please see the focus topics for Fall months: https://k12.hillsdale.edu/getmedia/0fb481ce-812e-4830-a094-002e5222273f/5th-Grade-Map.pdf

I gotta say, that curriculum looks pretty good.  I can't speak to anything but literature and literacy, really, and the reading list is solid, full of classics, and includes Frederick Douglas.

[apl68]

Lotsa stuff here, so random responsa and observations in no necessary particular order of  importance:

1) 'classical' means different things... most of the schools in the 'classical' and especially the 'classical Christian' k12 school orbit do not really consider the Renaissance, and esp Renaissance art, the sort of 'classical' stuff they are emphasizing.  Some do not even do much art at all.   They rather consider things like ancient language study, rhetoric, logic, and the medieval Trivium to be of much greater import. 

2) I get that Michelangelo is not some scumbag perv on the net proffering kiddie porn.  Obviously.   That said, exactly what educational objective would be furthered by showing prepubescent children art that depicts full-on nudity in people, esp children?   There certainly is no tradition amongst evangelical protestantism for showing such images, or even for artists within these movements, for making them.

Here is a link to an overview of the Hillsdale 5th grade curriculum. For art, please see the focus topics for Fall months: https://k12.hillsdale.edu/getmedia/0fb481ce-812e-4830-a094-002e5222273f/5th-Grade-Map.pdf

I gotta say, that curriculum looks pretty good.  I can't speak to anything but literature and literacy, really, and the reading list is solid, full of classics, and includes Frederick Douglas.

If they're that solid, then a controversial, perhaps overzealous "trigger warning" about Renaissance nudity isn't going to hurt anything.  Sounds like a tempest in a teapot.

[jimbogumbo]

If they're that solid, then a controversial, perhaps overzealous "trigger warning" about Renaissance nudity isn't going to hurt anything.  Sounds like a tempest in a teapot.

I think the Principal who had to resign might disagree? They were the canceled one.

[dismalist]

I'm often on the side of the cancellers when it allows or enhances competition. The case of this Florida charter school shares many of the characteristics of the other cancellation items in this thread. It all boils down to the question: Who owns the school?

If I understand the rules here correctly, the school's board owns the school. The board decides. So long as that board doesn't decide for the whole country, there is no problem. Any criteria or standards suggested here or elsewhere are irrelevant except insofar as the board chooses to consider them.

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

[jimbogumbo]

Alexandra Petri again. BTW, you can get WaPo cheaply if you are an Amazon prime person.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/03/24/tallahassee-principal-fired-david-art-controversy/

[nebo113]

I'm often on the side of the cancellers when it allows or enhances competition. The case of this Florida charter school shares many of the characteristics of the other cancellation items in this thread. It all boils down to the question: Who owns the school?

If I understand the rules here correctly, the school's board owns the school. The board decides. So long as that board doesn't decide for the whole country, there is no problem. Any criteria or standards suggested here or elsewhere are irrelevant except insofar as the board chooses to consider them.

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

It is my understanding that it is a PUBLIC charter school, therefore it receives public funding.  While many charter schools are to be commended, they are too often exempt from protections offered in non-charter public schools.  Moreover, charter schools can be selective in admissions.  It is also my understanding that this charter school is modeled on Hillsdale College, which is quite troublesome.  And deSantis has been very, very clear that he wants to destroy New College and turn it into the Hillsdale of the south.

[downer]

Alexandra Petri again. BTW, you can get WaPo cheaply if you are an Amazon prime person.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/03/24/tallahassee-principal-fired-david-art-controversy/

I think the Amazon prime cheap access to WaPo now $8 per month, rather than $4.

[dismalist]

I'm often on the side of the cancellers when it allows or enhances competition. The case of this Florida charter school shares many of the characteristics of the other cancellation items in this thread. It all boils down to the question: Who owns the school?

If I understand the rules here correctly, the school's board owns the school. The board decides. So long as that board doesn't decide for the whole country, there is no problem. Any criteria or standards suggested here or elsewhere are irrelevant except insofar as the board chooses to consider them.

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

It is my understanding that it is a PUBLIC charter school, therefore it receives public funding.  While many charter schools are to be commended, they are too often exempt from protections offered in non-charter public schools.  Moreover, charter schools can be selective in admissions.  It is also my understanding that this charter school is modeled on Hillsdale College, which is quite troublesome.  And deSantis has been very, very clear that he wants to destroy New College and turn it into the Hillsdale of the south.

If it's all wrong, competition will show what's better. The efficient need not fear competition.

Who owns the money? Public funding is a technicality. Borrowing from a film we watched when our daughter was very young -- Miss Congeniality (2000) -- "This is Texas. My florist receives public funding".

Let the money follow the child. It's happening in at least six states already.

[Wahoo Redux]

If it's all wrong, competition will show what's better. The efficient need not fear competition.

The invisible hand writes,
and having writ, moves on.

I'm not saying this is a good analogy, but the Branch Davidian had a lot of competition, was pretty efficient and competent, and had buy-in from the parents involved.  They were not publicly funded, however.

[dismalist]

If it's all wrong, competition will show what's better. The efficient need not fear competition.

The invisible hand writes,
and having writ, moves on.

I'm not saying this is a good analogy, but the Branch Davidian had a lot of competition, was pretty efficient and competent, and had buy-in from the parents involved.  They were not publicly funded, however.

"Publicly funded" is a name for a convention. Politics is about who owns the money. Parents are allowed to vote.

[Kron3007]

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

No, often they really don't.  By definition, half of all people are below average intelligence.  We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedogodgy, who may actually know something about it.

Regarding food, there are some parents feeding babies cola...

[dismalist]

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

No, often they really don't.  By definition, half of all people are below average intelligence.  We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedogodgy, who may actually know something about it.

Regarding food, there are some parents feeding babies cola...

We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedagogy, who may actually know something about it.

Then competition will not be a problem for those smart people.

If the consumers of education are deemed too stupid to recognize the quality, then take away the right to vote.

[jimbogumbo]

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

No, often they really don't.  By definition, half of all people are below average intelligence.  We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedogodgy, who may actually know something about it.

Regarding food, there are some parents feeding babies cola...

We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedagogy, who may actually know something about it.

Then competition will not be a problem for those smart people.

If the consumers of education are deemed too stupid to recognize the quality, then take away the right to vote.

Leaving the asides. The parents chose the school (of course that is their right!), but then they were outraged that the students were shown exactly what the school promised. I simply do not understand your points.

[dismalist]

When I go food shopping I don't need to defend my choices about what items to buy, and no one can tell me what to consume. Choices for one' childrens' education are no different. Father and mother know best.

No, often they really don't.  By definition, half of all people are below average intelligence.  We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedogodgy, who may actually know something about it.

Regarding food, there are some parents feeding babies cola...

We have some very smart people dedicating their lives to education and pedagogy, who may actually know something about it.

Then competition will not be a problem for those smart people.

If the consumers of education are deemed too stupid to recognize the quality, then take away the right to vote.

Leaving the asides. The parents chose the school (of course that is their right!), but then they were outraged that the students were shown exactly what the school promised. I simply do not understand your points.

Nay, nay, nay. Whatever happened or didn't happen at the school doesn't matter except to the school. It worries me not.

[Wahoo Redux]

If it's all wrong, competition will show what's better. The efficient need not fear competition.

The invisible hand writes,
and having writ, moves on.

I'm not saying this is a good analogy, but the Branch Davidian had a lot of competition, was pretty efficient and competent, and had buy-in from the parents involved.  They were not publicly funded, however.

"Publicly funded" is a name for a convention. Politics is about who owns the money. Parents are allowed to vote.

??