On the Money: Home Improvement

[spork]

Starting this so the recently-created thread on financial advice doesn't get muddled.

I have two raised vegetable box gardens in the backyard, in the middle of a larger square where I removed the grass and put down mulch. Some years ago I used 2X4s cannibalized from the basement as border edging around the perimeter of the square area. This lumber is now substantially rotted away. I'm thinking of putting down a stone border as a permanent replacement. Not a wall, no concrete footing, just a line of rough cut stone blocks all the way around the square. A pallet of these blocks will cost ~ $500 though. Wondering if it's worth it. It won't increase the value of the property but it will look nicer and be easier to maintain.

[Puget]

Well, what does "worth it" mean? A lot of the things we do to our houses are to increase our own enjoyment of them, not to increase the home's value (which is pretty meaningless anyway unless you plan to sell soon-- this year's trendy white kitchen will be dated looking in 5 years, let alone 20).

I have a pallet of pavers and other materials being delivered Friday to put in a patio-- a bit over $900 plus my own labor to build it (which I'm looking forward to-- becoming a homeowner seems to have activated strong latent liking to have a hands-on project traits in me). Will it enhance the resale value of the house? In theory a bit a suppose. Will it enhance the value of the house *to me*? Most definitely-- I expect to be spending a lot of time out there and using it for socializing, and it will be the future home of a small hot tub which I've long wanted.

[Hibush]

People do a lot of "home improvement" to please some hypothetical future buyer whom their realtor may have conjured. I don't think any of those are good to do.

Measure the value in how much pleasure it brings to you. Utility, beauty, pride in ones own craftsmanship, expressing self-determination. Lots of measures that are hard to count in dollars, but pay back immediately.

For raised beds, untreated lumber sides will rot out and need replacing, but I have yet to find a lower-maintenance, non-toxic solution. Stones will need to be reset, and will be home to some of the toughest weeds. But if they look a lot better, and you are up to tidying them annually, it sounds like a win.

[clean]

I dont really see this as a 'home improvement issue'. 

Do you Enjoy working with these raised boxes?  Would you spend $500 on a hobby cost that will bring you joy and entertainment for months to come and reduce the annoyance of ever increasing maintenance because of the rotting of the wood?

I think it is worth it, financially. 

I am glad to see that you are not thinking that it will increase the value of the property.  Likely it will not, but IF you enjoy doing it and will enjoy the view better, then it is certainly worth doing! 

(My friend planted tomatoes in his garden 2 years ago.  I think he said that the tomatoes ended up costing him $10 a pound!  Last year he used a smaller variety and was overwhelmed with them!  You do not garden as a cost effective means of growing food!  It is fun, tastes better, and provides a measure of joy, not a cost savings on the grocery bill!  Still, even at $10 a pound, he enjoyed being in the garden, so it was worth it!)

I think that the bottom line is that IF you want to spend $500 on your hobby, and it brings you joy, then do it! 

[Puget]

(My friend planted tomatoes in his garden 2 years ago.  I think he said that the tomatoes ended up costing him $10 a pound!  Last year he used a smaller variety and was overwhelmed with them!  You do not garden as a cost effective means of growing food!  It is fun, tastes better, and provides a measure of joy, not a cost savings on the grocery bill!  Still, even at $10 a pound, he enjoyed being in the garden, so it was worth it!)

A bit off topic perhaps but--
I agree saving money isn't the primary reason to garden, but it certainly can in the long run. There are a lot of start-up costs, but once you have your beds in and all your tools, the yearly costs are pretty low-- seeds, maybe some starter plants, some fertilizer. Since I enjoy the work I wouldn't include labor.

Last year from five tomato plants I probably harvested hundreds of pounds between June and October, plenty to eat and to share with friends and neighbors, plus canning some for winter which I'm still enjoying. Plus tons of other produce (basil is probably the biggest money saver over grocery store prices-- it's insane what they charge for a few sprigs). What the per lb cost is would depend on how you amortize the start-up costs, but over a few years it is almost certainly less than grocery store prices, at least for organic produce.

[Hibush]

Last year from five tomato plants I probably harvested hundreds of pounds between June and October, plenty to eat and to share with friends and neighbors, plus canning some for winter which I'm still enjoying. Plus tons of other produce (basil is probably the biggest money saver over grocery store prices-- it's insane what they charge for a few sprigs). What the per lb cost is would depend on how you amortize the start-up costs, but over a few years it is almost certainly less than grocery store prices, at least for organic produce.

Last summer we ate fantastic ripe-tomato and basil on home-made sourdough for lunch ninety days in a row. That benefit was worth $500 all by itself. Sorry to hijack this to a gardening thread. Back to the regular programming...

[Puget]

Last year from five tomato plants I probably harvested hundreds of pounds between June and October, plenty to eat and to share with friends and neighbors, plus canning some for winter which I'm still enjoying. Plus tons of other produce (basil is probably the biggest money saver over grocery store prices-- it's insane what they charge for a few sprigs). What the per lb cost is would depend on how you amortize the start-up costs, but over a few years it is almost certainly less than grocery store prices, at least for organic produce.

Last summer we ate fantastic ripe-tomato and basil on home-made sourdough for lunch ninety days in a row. That benefit was worth $500 all by itself. Sorry to hijack this to a gardening thread. Back to the regular programming...

Yes, we should pick this back up on the gardening thread!

[mamselle]

^ OK, but, as regarding construction details of raised boxes, wood inside with stone or brick outside works very well.

By the time the wood has rotted, it fills in the holes between the stones and sort-of cements them together.

Very 18th c.

M.

[Aster]

^ OK, but, as regarding construction details of raised boxes, wood inside with stone or brick outside works very well.

By the time the wood has rotted, it fills in the holes between the stones and sort-of cements them together.

Very 18th c.

M.

I just get infestations of termites and other pest wood-boring pests with that. I remove the rotten wood whenever and wherever I can.

[spork]

People do a lot of "home improvement" to please some hypothetical future buyer whom their realtor may have conjured. I don't think any of those are good to do.

Measure the value in how much pleasure it brings to you. Utility, beauty, pride in ones own craftsmanship, expressing self-determination. Lots of measures that are hard to count in dollars, but pay back immediately.

For raised beds, untreated lumber sides will rot out and need replacing, but I have yet to find a lower-maintenance, non-toxic solution. Stones will need to be reset, and will be home to some of the toughest weeds. But if they look a lot better, and you are up to tidying them annually, it sounds like a win.

This is purely a decorative project. The person we bought the house from thirteen years ago was, by neighbors' accounts, crazy. She ruined both the front and back yards in a variety of ways and I've been slowly altering the landscape. The stone would be edging around an area that is mulched, not walls for raised bed gardens.

I would probably get a sense of accomplishment out of this. My wife periodically complains that I spend too much time moving plants from the front yard to the back and vice versa, but I like to work outdoors. And there could be some currently unknown benefits. Two Decembers ago I spent about $3K to get a new insulated fiberglass front door and sidelights and energy-efficient replacement windows for an enclosed side porch. The porch has become my home office teaching space and yoga studio during the pandemic; previously I'd seal it off from the rest of the house and not use it during the winter months. The heating bill did not increase this past winter despite me being home all day, every day, and spending a lot of time on the porch. In terms of adding comfort and functionality to the house, the expense was well worth it.

[Juvenal]

At a certain point, when age begins to let itself be all-too patent, the same decline strikes the landscaping that so-enthusiastically I worked on.  Now, the yard stockade fence slumps and the low rock wall that held plantings next to the foundation surrenders to gravity. Let "estate" and self, pari passu, say "Hello" to entropy.

Still, there's the likelihood of my state making growing a personal patch of weed legal soon.  Well, maybe time to work on the compost heap again.

[ergative]

I'm not a home-owner yet, but Absolutive and I are getting to a place where we'll start looking in the next year or two. I've already got Plans for whole wallsfull of built-in bookcases. Like this: https://pixels.com/featured/holy-cow-what-kind-of-crazy-people-used-to-live-warren-miller.html

[Aster]

My uncle did that with an entire spare room. He packed it with decades of collected science fiction novels. Seeing this for the first time was a sci-fi nerd miracle.

Now, in today's world where libraries are being converted into wifi hotspots and computer centers, and bookstores are being converted into wifi hotspots and computer centers, my uncle's personal library has become even more awesome as a print book resource.

[onehappyunicorn]

I think it's important to note, as well, that many projects don't increase the value of your home but do make it easier to sell. I know the two times that I was home shopping that I certainly looked more favorably on homes that showed that the owners cared and were invested in maintaining them. I don't garden much but since I like to cook I do grow herbs. I've been just doing them in pots but I may build myself a planter on my back deck this year.

[ergative]

My uncle did that with an entire spare room. He packed it with decades of collected science fiction novels. Seeing this for the first time was a sci-fi nerd miracle.

WANT