Univ of California

[Hibush]

The University of California is interesting to follow because it is so big and the system is influenced by demographic changes that come to the rest of the country later.

The LA Times has a story on the most recent application cycle.

They say that it was even harder to get in because the % admitted was lower. But I contend that it was easier to get in because more students were admitted. That's because I expect that nearly all the additional applications were from people who didn't get admitted. A quarter million students applied. That is mind boggling for most admissions offices.

The students are stunningly good. For UCLA, the median GPA is 4.5/4 while taking an average of 23 AP courses. UC dropped the SAT requirement, but with applicants of that caliber, I can't imagine what else the SAT tells you after their standardized evaluation. Reports credit the dropping of the requirement with a 28% increase in applications. Did any of the students who were afraid of the SAT get admitted? Seems unlikely.

The ethnic diversity is also far from national averages. The ~85 thousand in-state admits are 37% Latino, 34% Asian, 20% Caucasian and 5% Black. Again, all stunningly strong applicants. How does that compare to diversity efforts where you are? I bet very different from the schools in the dire-straits thread.

[mleok]

For context, the population of California is 39% Latino, 36% white, 15% Asian or Pacific Islander, 6% African American.

[Hegemony]

An average of 23 AP courses? How is that even possible? Aren't AP courses year-long? So if a high-school student takes 8 year-long courses per year, that's nearly three years of high school with nothing but AP classes?  Is that right? Or what am I missing?

As for 4.5 out of 4.0, grade inflation must have run rampant, because I am not seeing that level of amazingness in the college students I teach. Most of them still can't spell its correctly, let alone discourse on issues of identity in Shakespeare.

[Hibush]

An average of 23 AP courses? How is that even possible? Aren't AP courses year-long? So if a high-school student takes 8 year-long courses per year, that's nearly three years of high school with nothing but AP classes?  Is that right? Or what am I missing?

As for 4.5 out of 4.0, grade inflation must have run rampant, because I am not seeing that level of amazingness in the college students I teach. Most of them still can't spell its correctly, let alone discourse on issues of identity in Shakespeare.

I suspect the AP course get extra grade points, so if you have a lot of those--as they seem to--the GPA can climb.

How do you even start to evaluate a quarter million applications? Especially when the distribution of quantitative criteria extends beyond the upper limit of that criterion.

[wellfleet]

UCs, across the board, restrict how many courses students can get extra grade points in--I think it's 8 semester's worth, across 10-12th grade.

It's a pretty fiddly system: https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/admission-requirements/freshman-requirements/gpa-requirement.html

[mythbuster]

Most "elite" level schools had record breaking numbers of applicants this past year. The question is, how many of them were truly competitive applicants?
    My alma mater, Duke University, saw an increase in applications of 25% for a total of 50,000 applications for a freshman class targeted of 1600 students! But if all of that 25% increase were students below the cutoff for basic consideration, in reality it would have no impact on how hard it was to get in. The university just gets more application fees and sends out more reject letters (or rather emails nowadays).

Of course, the schools won't ever tell you how many applications are rejected in the first cull.

To add to the confusion, I'm guessing many elite schools made more admit offers than usual, because they knew people were applying to more schools, and so would have more choices. They needed to protect their yield number as much as possible. I also think the waitlists this year were also insane. This may have been the year where waitlisted students cold calling elite admissions might have really paid off.

Yes, the UCs have their own special way to calculate the GPA. They may be the originators of of the 0.33 "bump" for things like honors and AP courses.

[whynotbc]

An average of 23 AP courses? How is that even possible? Aren't AP courses year-long? So if a high-school student takes 8 year-long courses per year, that's nearly three years of high school with nothing but AP classes?  Is that right? Or what am I missing?

It might be because many AP courses are year-long classes. When I was in high school, AP Calculus AB was AP Calculus 9 in the Fall and AP Calculus 10 in the Spring. Each semester was a "course".

[dismalist]

An average of 23 AP courses? How is that even possible? Aren't AP courses year-long? So if a high-school student takes 8 year-long courses per year, that's nearly three years of high school with nothing but AP classes?  Is that right? Or what am I missing?

It might be because many AP courses are year-long classes. When I was in high school, AP Calculus AB was AP Calculus 9 in the Fall and AP Calculus 10 in the Spring. Each semester was a "course".

How does one get into an AP course nowadays, in California?

[jimbogumbo]

How an AP course is run and when is a local decision-no statewide processes anywhere.

We should also acknowledge that for the UC system, as for any of the strong flagship state universities, that the applicant pool consists of great students from many different states. The GPA stats listed are not different oRm Chapel Hill or UMich Ann Arbor.

[wellfleet]

An average of 23 AP courses? How is that even possible? Aren't AP courses year-long? So if a high-school student takes 8 year-long courses per year, that's nearly three years of high school with nothing but AP classes?  Is that right? Or what am I missing?

It might be because many AP courses are year-long classes. When I was in high school, AP Calculus AB was AP Calculus 9 in the Fall and AP Calculus 10 in the Spring. Each semester was a "course".

How does one get into an AP course nowadays, in California?

Huge variation, of course, but when my kid was in the first year of high school, the only social studies course he could take that met the UC/CSU "A through G" standard was AP Human Geography. This meant that every kid who was college-bound at all, or even thinking about it, was taking this AP course in the 9th grade. My kid took the class and did ok, but I declined to have him even try the AP exam at the end of the year. I wanted his first AP exam experience to be better than that.

Of course, his first AP exam experience was taking the covid-era AP World History exam at home, in 45 minutes, in spring 2020.  Oh well.

[fishbrains]

The ethnic diversity is also far from national averages. The ~85 thousand in-state admits are 37% Latino, 34% Asian, 20% Caucasian and 5% Black. Again, all stunningly strong applicants. How does that compare to diversity efforts where you are? I bet very different from the schools in the dire-straits thread.

About the same. We have 50% Baptists, 25% Pentecostal, 15% Methodist, 5% Catholic, and 10% Heathen. Of course, the Methodists are all going to burn in hell because they have the lady-preachers and all, so maybe 25-30% Heathen.

Seriously, 76% of voters in my county voted for Trump. I'm guessing some didn't vote for Trump because he is too liberal.

Anyway, carry on.

[Hibush]

About the same. We have 50% Baptists, 25% Pentecostal, 15% Methodist, 5% Catholic, and 10% Heathen. Of course, the Methodists are all going to burn in hell because they have the lady-preachers and all, so maybe 25-30% Heathen.

Seriously, 76% of voters in my county voted for Trump. I'm guessing some didn't vote for Trump because he is too liberal.

Anyway, carry on.

So probably not a lot of AP Human Geography or AP History?

[fishbrains]

About the same. We have 50% Baptists, 25% Pentecostal, 15% Methodist, 5% Catholic, and 10% Heathen. Of course, the Methodists are all going to burn in hell because they have the lady-preachers and all, so maybe 25-30% Heathen.

Seriously, 76% of voters in my county voted for Trump. I'm guessing some didn't vote for Trump because he is too liberal.

Anyway, carry on.

So probably not a lot of AP Human Geography or AP History?

As long as it ain't none of that revisionist History stuff or whatever our elected leaders choose to call Critical Race Theory today.