In-person meetings during a pandemic

[Hegemony]

We're in one of those areas where the Delta variant is rocketing higher — well, aren't we all?

The university is determined to keep classes in person. Okay, I understand that a lot of revenue was lost by going online last year, and that the university is desperate. But their attitude of "Everything's over! It's business as usual!" is making me gnash my teeth.

Up till the week before the semester begins, all administrative and departmental business is online. That week, we are commanded to attend a week-long series of orientations and workshops (some of them on Covid rules!). In person. It has been repeatedly emphasized to us that only ADA exemptions will excuse us from attending in person. Even though last year this whole long, grueling (pointless, indescribably tedious) week was online, without losing any of its (small and dubious) quality.

Furthermore all departmental and administrative meetings are required to be in person. No Zooming allowed. Business as usual! No matter what!

This is driving me nuts. Covid cases in our region are at crazy levels. The hospital ICU is at something like 98% capacity. In my department are all kinds of people in vulnerable situations. They may not have ADA-qualified conditions themselves, but they have children with cancer, or spouses with cancer, or all kinds of things that you don't want to bring breakthrough Covid home to. Sometimes the faculty members have arranged to teach online because of these things — but they are still required to attend all these infernal meetings in person!

It's possible to push back if one has tenure, but some of them do not have tenure yet. Some of them are non-tenure-track.

Yet almost daily, dire warnings and admonitions come from central administration, that we are not allowed to skip or Zoom in to in-person meetings. We're told that if anyone wants to do that, they should apply for sabbatical or leave without pay, which will only be granted according to the usual rules (i.e. rarely).

What is your place doing about meetings and such? Zoom was so efficient for meetings — and the chat function is a positive boon — that this kind of requirement, at this juncture, looks either foolhardy or primitive to me.

[Parasaurolophus]

Ours are all online.

Someone is pushing to have IRB meetings in person, but... I don't think so.

[Aster]

I feel that a middle ground is prudent and optimal.

[Ruralguy]

In person classes, most of faculty and staff vaccinated, students nominally at 70 percent, but probably higher. President had ordered all events on campus to be normal, but following CDC guidelines, so masked and such.
The DeAn has scheduled in person general faculty meetings. Committees will just do what they do. Some will Zoom for now. Mandatory testing of unvaccinated.  All faculty can apply for remote teaching if in situation you described. Probably half dozen at most will do some version of that. We have 100 faculty, 80 tenure track, 50-60 already tenured.

[Hibush]

The rules for group meetings is changing fairly frequently as conditions change. We are >95% vaccinated across the board, so the immediate risk of death from university people mingling is not so large. The local ICUs are at normal non-Covid capacity. Nevertheless, we have an indoor mask mandate and are very careful with visitors. I have one indoor meeting planned for later this month where we will do both masking and distancing for the <100 participants. It is a group, and an activity, where people have really been eager to see one another. The Zoom substitutes weren't very satisfying.

I think faculty meetings and many general orientations will remain online in the fall even as most courses go in-person.

If someone were to hold an ill-advised "required" in-person thing for faculty and it was boycotted, the organizer would be the one in trouble.

Thanks for the horror stories that make me appreciate that the inconveniences here are so few.

[clean]

We have meetings this week.  We have the option to WebEx / Teams in.
ALL  faculty, staff and students (regardless of vaccination status) MUST be tested ON CAMPUS over the first 3 weeks of classes.  (Why?  I dont know!... IF someone doesnt, THEN WHAT?  I dont know.  Is one test at the start enough or have any meaning??  I dont think so!!  ) 

I see cruise ships now requiring that all people be vaccinated, and some have even moved to require a negative COVID test within 72 hours of embarkation REGARDLESS of vaccination status... and news Today showed a Carnival Ship come back to port with a number of positive cases.  So what is the point of testing to start with?  IF we tested regularly, that may be different, but one and done?? 

I will webex into the president's meeting tomorrow.  I will probably attend the college meeting on Thursday, but it is outside my planning horizon.  (oh, they serve lunch, so that may impact the decision to at least be on campus!)


ON preview... Our hospitalization rate is very high. We have about 350 in the hospital and 100 of those in the ICU!  That is the highest I have seen PERIOD.  Six weeks ago it we had less than 25 in the hospital and fewer than 9 in the ICU. 

So we are IN a bad place now, and I dont know that I want to be around anyone. Ive been staying home and avoiding crowds. I dont leave the house without a mask. 

[Hibush]

ALL  faculty, staff and students (regardless of vaccination status) MUST be tested ON CAMPUS over the first 3 weeks of classes.  (Why?  I dont know!... IF someone doesnt, THEN WHAT?  I dont know.  Is one test at the start enough or have any meaning??  I dont think so!!  ) 

I see cruise ships now requiring that all people be vaccinated, and some have even moved to require a negative COVID test within 72 hours of embarkation REGARDLESS of vaccination status... and news Today showed a Carnival Ship come back to port with a number of positive cases.  So what is the point of testing to start with?  IF we tested regularly, that may be different, but one and done?? 

If the positive rates in screening testing are very low, it is possible to contain nuclei of infection and limit further spread. Very low means less than one in a thousand tested. (Rates are much higher if only symptomatic people are tested.)

Your location does not appear to meet the criterion, but it is possible that the vaccinated university population is low enough for containment to work.

If vaccinated university people enjoy participating in local superpreader events, the method is far less likely to work. Also, you miss a few positives in the screening, because people who were just infected don't test positive yet. A followup test several days later would catch those.

[AmLitHist]

At our opening sessions yesterday (Zoom), one of the points repeated several times by the Admin in charge of health/safety/COVID response was:  NO F2F meetings of faculty, admins, etc. this fall--use Zoom/Teams. (Classes are a mix of F2F, virtual lecture, and online.)

Apparently nobody told the campus-level poohbahs:  today there are joint division ad LA division meetings on campus, and my dept. meeting is F2F tomorrow, as are several other events the rest of the week.  Not going to any of them. We're supposed to use sick days if we don't attend, but I'll make them come after me for them since I'll be participating in other remote meetings on those same days.

I will say, I went to more meetings in the past 18 months than in the previous few years combined.  I don't mind logging in and even participating, but I'm much less likely to actually drive to campus for those same meetings.  Also, the remote ones tended to be much more focused and shorter than the usual in-person ones.

[sinenomine]

My institution is planning an on-ground semester and has mandated vaccinations for everyone. Meetings, I'm told, will be on Zoom, since there are some folks who have been working remotely since before the pandemic (we used to have in-ground meetings with those folks Zooming in). However, for our opening week of faculty and staff meetings half of them are tagged as hybrid and half Zoom, with two F2F meals planned to be held outdoors. I'm quietly hoping for rain to see what happens then....

[Caracal]

It does illustrate the way in which institutions seem to have a really hard time balancing risk and benefits and being honest about it. Could classes contribute to covid spread? Of course they could, but they are important and vaccinations can reduce risk to a point where it tips the scales in favor of doing it. Are in person faculty meetings equally important? Doubtful. If it can be done outside, that's fine, but if not, do it over Zoom. Nothing that vital will be lost.

The temptation, I suspect, is to just pretend there aren't calculated risks being made, which just leads to more cynicism and anxiety.

[Cheerful]

...Furthermore all departmental and administrative meetings are required to be in person. No Zooming allowed. Business as usual! No matter what!
....

Yet almost daily, dire warnings and admonitions come from central administration, that we are not allowed to skip or Zoom in to in-person meetings. We're told that if anyone wants to do that, they should apply for sabbatical or leave without pay, which will only be granted according to the usual rules (i.e. rarely).

Weird.  Why are admins being so mean and ridiculous?  Covid or no covid, Zooming in to meetings should always be an option.  It's 2021, not 1921.  Skyping in to meetings was common at some U's for a long time, pre-Covid.  Units at your place should proceed with the option of Zooming in to meetings.  No way for admins to police every meeting.

Why aren't faculty more collectively assertive when confronted with bizarre admin behavior?
 

[rxprof]

For once, I feel like my institution/department is being a little more cautious. Students, staff, and faculty must be vaccinated. Masks are required in indoor spaces. Teaching is >90% in person; however, most meetings continue to be virtual. My colleagues and I are continuing to work from home unless we prefer to be on campus, our work cannot be done remotely, or we are teaching. There has been a little bit of a push for social gatherings as the new academic year starts, but the push is gentle enough that many of us are ignoring it.

[Biologist_]

Yet almost daily, dire warnings and admonitions come from central administration, that we are not allowed to skip or Zoom in to in-person meetings. We're told that if anyone wants to do that, they should apply for sabbatical or leave without pay, which will only be granted according to the usual rules (i.e. rarely).

I don't think anyone keeps track of whether faculty attend meetings here. Rarely if ever do all of the TT faculty in the department show up for a department meeting. Most attend and participate fairly regularly and it works well enough for us to get things done.

So far, we're planning to be in-person this fall with a few exceptions for large lecture classes, but we also have a vaccine mandate and an indoor mask mandate for everyone on campus. If my department, or any given committee, decides to switch meetings to Zoom, I can't imagine our administration caring one way or the other.

[Anon1787]

My department is still doing meetings via Zoom (with smaller classes in person and large lectures online). I agree that Zoom seems more efficient in most cases and actually increases attendance.

[evil_physics_witchcraft]

Business as usual over here. In person meetings WITH refreshments- and we're a bunch of scientists. You'd think we'd know better...