Experimental windowless dormitory project at UCSB

[dismalist]

The donation is a bribe, necessary because the building has no windows.

Our views of human nature differ. :-)

Sure, I understand the concept of a bribe, but the administrators who agreed to it don't personally benefit, so why do it?

They do benefit. Prestige for getting stuff for their employer, so job security. Perhaps pay raises. Promotion possibilities. And so on. [They are taking a risk of a backlash against the bad taste, but they may have discounted it, or don't know what taste means.]

That's how bureaucracies, public and private, work. In a private bureaucracy this kind of idiocy can't go on forever. Though it can until the endowment is gone.

[marshwiggle]

marshwiggle wrote "My understanding is that the residence in question is to be built with an ocean view. Unless it's in Panama, I'm guessing that only one side of the building will have an ocean view. If all rooms had windows, the suckers students who were excited to get into a building with an ocean view might be less impressed when their "view" is of a parking lot."

I think they missed a big opportunity to charge more for ocean views.

That's what's typically done for apartments, cruise ships (interior vs. exterior cabins), etc. This proposal is a "democratic" alternative. Also, I believe part of the proposal was "virtual windows" in each room. When I was on a cruise, as I recall one TV channel was a live feed from a camera at the bow of the ship. The "virtual windows" in a building could all have the same live-feed view, and the camera could be placed for the best view possible.
If the rooms all had Florida ceilings (daylight lights above a translucent ceiling) that would be another way to make them seem much less like cells.

Honestly, the visually aesthetic factor of windowless rooms is the least problematic of all.

[mleok]

Some new details surface in this Washington Post article,

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2021/10/30/ucsb-dorm-charlie-munger/

In particular, the $200 million donation is only a small fraction of the $1.5 billion cost of the project.

Also, the stated reasoning for the windowless rooms is that it allows for smaller private bedrooms, and also higher density than traditional designs.

[jimbogumbo]

Some new details surface in this Washington Post article,

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2021/10/30/ucsb-dorm-charlie-munger/

In particular, the $200 million donation is only a small fraction of the $1.5 billion cost of the project.

Also, the stated reasoning for the windowless rooms is that it allows for smaller private bedrooms, and also higher density than traditional designs.

And he also did something similar at Michigan:

"The University of Michigan facility was also designed to increase density by largely eschewing windows. In 2013, he donated $110 million to build a dorm for graduate students, a building originally set for 300 residents that he conceived as a space for 600."

[kaysixteen]

It also figures to create significantly higher electric bills, for increased lighting and ac use.

What if the kids, by and large, rebel and refuse to live in it?

[Hegemony]

I would think that right now, of all times, the problematic aspects of buildings with little direct exterior ventilation would be clear. If one kid in the cohort has COVID, can they really keep it from spreading to everyone else? Not to mention, as one college kid commented, "Kids this age don't smell good! We need to be able to open windows!"

[artalot]

If you read around, it's pretty clear that most architects think this is a terrible idea. It's ideological on the part of the donor/wannabe architect. He seems to be using college students to enact his ideas on livability and productivity. Sounds terrible, dystopian and unethical. Shouldn't he at least have to go through IRB? 

[Durchlässigkeitsbeiwert]

It also figures to create significantly higher electric bills, for increased lighting and ac use.

What if the kids, by and large, rebel and refuse to live in it?

The cheapest single room for undergrads in UCSB is nearly 20k per year
https://www.housing.ucsb.edu/apply/rates
- so any utility cost is a negligible fraction of the total
- I expect new dormitory to be oversubscribed as long as it priced even at 1k per month (with meal plan)

Overall, it is curious to see a cubicle approach to office space applied to the accommodation at this scale. Though, multiple details make Colossus of Prora look very favourable in comparison.

[Wahoo Redux]

This sounds like the premise for a bad Sci-Fi Channel TV movie.

[jimbogumbo]

This sounds like the premise for a bad Sci-Fi Channel TV movie.

I will "channel" one of the SyFy execs on a hot mic: "We've never met a bad premise. We've done Sharknado 1-57 fer Chrissakes". Thank God there are rubes willing to help bankroll my phony baloney job."

[apl68]

This sounds like the premise for a bad Sci-Fi Channel TV movie.

Or a reality TV show.

[Aster]

CNN is showing some pictures and sharing some student experiences from a related project.

"Here's what it's like to live in one of Charlie Munger's windowless dorms"
https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/02/business/munger-residences-michigan-windowless/index.html

[marshwiggle]

CNN is showing some pictures and sharing some student experiences from a related project.

"Here's what it's like to live in one of Charlie Munger's windowless dorms"
https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/02/business/munger-residences-michigan-windowless/index.html

One quotation:

Some students have gotten used to living without a window in their room.
"I wasn't sure how living in a bedroom with no window was was going to work out but for me, at least, it's really no big deal," graduate student Sabrina Ivanenco said. "I think that once you exit your bedroom, you have a very beautiful living space."
In fact the building has a rating of 8.8 out of 10 on veryapt.com. Reviewers praise the building's amenities, including study rooms and a fitness center. And each room has a queen-sized bed and its own bathroom, with common space that features a large kitchen, living room, dining area and natural light.

Unless the reviews are gamed, that's interesting.

[apl68]

CNN is showing some pictures and sharing some student experiences from a related project.

"Here's what it's like to live in one of Charlie Munger's windowless dorms"
https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/02/business/munger-residences-michigan-windowless/index.html

One quotation:

Some students have gotten used to living without a window in their room.
"I wasn't sure how living in a bedroom with no window was was going to work out but for me, at least, it's really no big deal," graduate student Sabrina Ivanenco said. "I think that once you exit your bedroom, you have a very beautiful living space."
In fact the building has a rating of 8.8 out of 10 on veryapt.com. Reviewers praise the building's amenities, including study rooms and a fitness center. And each room has a queen-sized bed and its own bathroom, with common space that features a large kitchen, living room, dining area and natural light.

Unless the reviews are gamed, that's interesting.

Well, people can adapt to pretty much anything, especially when they're young.  If the situation includes some luxuries and comforts to help compensate for what has been lost, they can come to like the new situation--whether or not it's an honestly desirable or healthy one. 

Here's a thought that occurred to me early on.  And I'm sure not just me.  These students are "digital natives."  They've been surrounded by screens and electronics since birth.  How much did they ever notice that there are such things as windows and a world outside their screens in the first place?  Even 30 years ago, when I was a TA, I noticed that the affluent, suburban-raised traditional students around me mostly seemed to have little awareness of nature or of natural surroundings.  They went outside to walk across campus, sun themselves on really pleasant days, and play sports, and that was about it for most of them.  There were exceptions--and I notice that they came mainly from small-town backgrounds.

[Puget]

The weird thing about door rooms is that they are supposed to be sleeping, studying, and socializing spaces all in one room, often for two or even three people. That's a lot to ask of one room, and generally really bad for quality sleep. So to the extent that you can separate out those functions and provide nice spaces for studying and socializing-- with windows!-- and then small sleeping compartments for each student, I can see that being a lot better. That, after all, is how most other housing works. And if you truly are only going to use the sleeping rooms for sleeping, they don't really need windows (in fact, being able to perfectly control the lighting is ideal). The rub is that people are still likely at times going to need or want to use the sleeping rooms for other things, at which point lack of natural light becomes a real problem. The example of the student who had to isolate in their room for a week during covid quarantine is a perfect example.