Questions for Administrators on Work Week and Commute

[Like2Ski]

I was offered a new job in administration. It's a step up the ladder for me. I have a few questions for Dept. Chairs and Deans.

1. How many days are you expected to be on campus? Is your college/university willing to accommodate a flexible schedule? Or, are they rigid with 5 days/week on campus (especially now "after" covid).

2. Regarding the commute to work, how far would you be willing to commute for a better position? My spouse and I both have jobs in academia, but unfortunately in different states. It's been rough but we can't seem to find jobs in the same general region, let alone the same state.

[Hegemony]

Our deans are on campus every weekday. For department heads, less so, but it depends on the department. I'm a department head of a very small department and I'm basically never needed on campus for business as a head; it all happens by email and Zoom. But the heads of larger departments seem to be in a lot of in-person meetings on campus.

As for the commute, I think those questions would apply to everyone, and there are many different arrangements, many of them quite complex and fairly miserable.

[sinenomine]

I was in a lengthy meeting about this topic yesterday. Our consensus was that it really depends on the culture of both the school and the division within it. I'm a dean for a largely on-ground division, while other deans oversee largely online areas, and one oversees an entirely remote division. I'm typically on campus 3 or 4 days a week, but not necessarily 9:00-5:00, and work remotely the other days. If I need to come in for a weekend or evening event, I try to take some time during a weekday to make up for it. Another dean I work with works remotely a couple days a week and makes sure she holds in-person meetings midweek. Another is totally remote.

So in short, 1. Days expected to be on campus varies on a case by base basis, and 2. Personally, I wouldn't want to commute over an hour (my current commute is half and hour, barring traffic or weather issues).

[jerseyjay]

I would think that the answer to question one depend much on the culture of the school.

At my school, faculty are contractually obligated to be on campus at least three days a week. Department heads are considered faculty, and hence they do not have to be here more than anybody else. That said, they are more visible, since students, faculty members, and administrators may want to see them more. They tend to do more advising with students. And faculty members would tend to grumble if they could never talk to the chair.

Administrators, on the other hands (deans, provosts, etc.) are supposed to be here five days  a week during business hours. There are meetings, etc., all day. And part of an administrator's job is to build relationships with people, which means being on campus.

All this said, I should say that Covid has upended much of this. That is, many meetings have gone online, and there is more acceptance of working from home. Nonetheless, if an administrator is perceived as mainly working from home and not coming to campus, that looks bad.

The answer to your second question does not seem to be administrator specific. The main difference is that administrators (as opposed to professors) have more typical commuting schedules, i.e., are more likely to hit rush hour traffic. For example, there are professors who live two hours away from campus. Since they probably do not have to come in more than thrice a week, and can come late or leave early, commuting is not that big a deal. If they were to become an administrator and have to come in around 9-5 five days a week, their commute would be that much harder. I have heard of faculty members who live in other regions--e.g. a professor in Rhode Island who lives in Manhattan, or a professor in Houston who lives in North Carolina, or even a faculty member in New Jersey who lives in Florida--who make it work because they only come in a few days and maintain a high research productivity. This would not work as an administrator.

[Hibush]

Our dean spends a lot of time on government, stakeholder and donor relations. That means a lot of travel, with the schedule largely determined by when those people are available. I'd figure two days a week (can be weekend) of travel, then another 40 to 50 hours of managing the college.

[Ruralguy]

First of all, if you are working with donors or the government, you are of course on the job, just to be clear.

But just generally speaking, our Deans are expected to be very available, which is expected at a small college. That being said, all take vacation, and most ended the work day at a reasonable hour save for during the most crisisy of crises. There was some weekend work expected, but not onerous, and not for all the Deans. That's more like "show up at the football game and hob nob" or "greet prospies."  But 3 days a week, and especially if you aren't available remotely on the other days would be a non-starter for a dean here. Most chairs could probably survive that though.

As for commutes, I wouldn't go much beyond an hour (and have twice done commutes a bit under that). Longer ones might be doable, but expect people to groan if you arrive at 10 and leave at 3.

[pgher]

Today is my first as chair. I plan to be on campus basically every day, basically all day. I will be supervising several staff who are 8-4:30, so I need to be around. Plus, the kind of meetings I'm in now are more likely to be in person.

[Ruralguy]

Yes, if you need to "huddle with the team", so to speak, you probably have to be there in person, at least a significant amount of time, if not all of the time. Probably depends on how well they know you and your expectations.

[Hibush]

As for commutes, I wouldn't go much beyond an hour (and have twice done commutes a bit under that). Longer ones might be doable, but expect people to groan if you arrive at 10 and leave at 3.

Expect your spouse to groan if you arrive a 7:30 and leave at 6.

[jerseyjay]

As for commutes, I wouldn't go much beyond an hour (and have twice done commutes a bit under that). Longer ones might be doable, but expect people to groan if you arrive at 10 and leave at 3.

Expect your spouse to groan if you arrive a 7:30 and leave at 6.

This is actually a pretty normal workday in my part of the world.

Which I think is sort of the point: as one moves up in the administrative ladder, one's job become more like a "normal" office job and less like an academic job. Administrators I know are more likely to wear suits to the office, work 40 hour weeks (more when necessary), use MS Outlook to maintain their calendars, etc. These are things that most office workers take for granted (at least before Covid), but most academics would find stultifying.

At my school, a department chair is somewhere between the life of a professor and the life of a dean. Coming to school everyday is not expected. Being on campus more than the average professor is, and having more time for meetings is, too.

[dinomom]

I am a chair and our expectations re: when to be on campus are not laid out. I usually come in five days, but the past chair came in once a week (students were angry as well as many faculty but that didn't change anything). If I could, I would only come in three, but I am in a teaching-intensive department where we have more contact hours per credit than some other departments.

Our deans are definitely in 8:30-4 (these are the working hours for the administrative staff). Most faculty, chairs included, don't come in until 10.

I wouldn't really want to commute more than 15 minutes (though for several years I did commute 1.5 hours each way, which is why I'm burned out on commuting) so I am probably the wrong person to ask.

[mamselle]

On commuting times, there are a few hacks to consider.

1. I worked for one wonderful, super-geeky lab PI at a pharma that had hired him away from a competitor several states away.

He moved in during the late summer, and one day, idly curious, I asked what the little pocket-sized notebook with all the time entries was (anticipating I might have to transcribe it some day).

"That's how I track my commute," he said. "See, if I leave at 5.30 AM, it only takes 25 min, but an hour later takes 45 minutes and two hours later takes an hour-and-a-half. So, most mornings, I leave at six, get breakfast near the office, read the paper, and still get to the lab an hour ahead of everyone else, to be on top of my day.

"Then if I leave at 3, no-one has to worry, they know I'll be in early the next day and anything we didn't fix before CoB the day before will still get done before they revv the robots up on the bench at 9."

He had one of the smoothest-running labs I ever worked for; everyone wanted to be on his team.

2. I don't advise this, but another fellow I worked for, a seasoned character from the UK, lived far enough away that it should have taken him 25-30 min. to get into campus. But he was routinely there in 15 (as clocked by hearing his wife say, "Goodbye" to him at 8:45, when he'd call in to say he was leaving, and were there any calls?" and seeing him walk in the door at 9 AM sharp.

I asked, once, how he managed it without getting speeding tickets all the time. He chuckled and said, "Oh, I just turn up the plumminess factor, claim I haven't been here very long, and they smile, and wave, and let me go."

M.

[apl68]

When my parents were first married they lived across town from the college that Mom attended.  Although not usually the world's best automotive navigator, Mom managed to work out a maximally-efficient route across town to her school.  She made such good time in her commute--while still, from what they tell me, respecting speed limits--that she was dubbed "Speedy Gonzales."

I've spent most of my life commuting on foot.  My usual route to work takes not quite 15 minutes.  I can get there in just under 10 by taking the most direct route.  The commuting on foot times were just a bit longer at my old job in the big city, but living that close to work meant putting up with a dump of an apartment.

[pink_]

I'm an academic dean, which means that my job is kind of hybrid between faculty and admin. I'm on campus 4 or 5 days in the fall and 5 days in the spring. I don't hold traditional business hours though I generally work the equivalent when you combine the home and office time.

I have a very short commute and prefer it so.

[simpleSimon]

I was offered a new job in administration. It's a step up the ladder for me. I have a few questions for Dept. Chairs and Deans.

1. How many days are you expected to be on campus? Is your college/university willing to accommodate a flexible schedule? Or, are they rigid with 5 days/week on campus (especially now "after" covid).

2. Regarding the commute to work, how far would you be willing to commute for a better position? My spouse and I both have jobs in academia, but unfortunately in different states. It's been rough but we can't seem to find jobs in the same general region, let alone the same state.

As others have suggested your face time on campus depends on the culture of the school/department.  It also depends on the length of your tenure and the relationship you have with your colleagues.  If you are new to campus you need to be there... otherwise you risk sending the wrong message and that could backfire rather quickly.  If you are a longtime campus citizen and a known quantity you will probably have more flexibility.  Bear in mind that you will have to prove yourself in any new position and people will be watching.  For now, resolve to be there all day every day. The flexibility will come later.