Texas Bill Nukes Tenure

[Wahoo Redux]

Public universities could no longer offer tenure for professors under Texas Senate bill

[Caracal]

Public universities could no longer offer tenure for professors under Texas Senate bill

Although this kind of thing is definitely concerning, it sounds like the bill might stall in the house.

[downer]

There's the abstract question of whether tenure is a good idea, which I think is an important one.

But then there's the question of what are the Republican motivations for wanting to avoid tenure. You'd think that since they are always moaning about how the liberals are intolerant of right wing speech, they would want to do more to protect speech by keeping tenure.

Presumably they think this move will help them replace all the atheists and liberals with conservative Christians. Or do they just want to do away with education, in their more mild version of the Khmer Rouge?

[RatGuy]

You'd think that since they are always moaning about how the liberals are intolerant of right wing speech, they would want to do more to protect speech by keeping tenure.

Presumably they think this move will help them replace all the atheists and liberals with conservative Christians.

My take is that they believe that "tenure" = "people who don't work for a salary, and since public institutions depend in part on tax dollars, tenured professors are basically liberal elite welfare queens." They already believe the process fails right-leaning profs -- just consider the guy from Alabama who "resigned" over politics, when in reality he was denied tenure. I think the public resentment comes from the image that tenured professors no longer work but still draw a paycheck, more than the thought that they're brainwashers. But that's just my take from talking to non-academics who support the abolishing of tenure. (FWIW, they're the same people who argue for term limits in Congress)

[Parasaurolophus]

My sense is that Texas's public universities have considerably more reputation to lose from a faculty exodus/recruitment trouble than Florida's.

[downer]

Judging from https://www.univstats.com/states/ they are both in the top five states for number of students. Texas is #2, and Florida is #3 equal with New York. So these changes affect many professors and students (though private universities are not affected are they?)

[Sun_Worshiper]

This would be the time for the "adults in the room" that are supposedly still veto players in the Republican party to step up - and it seems from the article the house speaker is doing that in this case. Nuking tenure would be enormously self destructive for these states.

[mleok]

This would be the time for the "adults in the room" that are supposedly still veto players in the Republican party to step up - and it seems from the article the house speaker is doing that in this case. Nuking tenure would be enormously self destructive for these states.

Doing so would destroy Texas's aspiration to replace California as the innovation hub of the United States. Not that their regressive social policies aren't already inflicting harm on their ability to attract knowledge workers.

[Wahoo Redux]

Public universities could no longer offer tenure for professors under Texas Senate bill

Although this kind of thing is definitely concerning, it sounds like the bill might stall in the house.

The point of the bill is most likely to earn brownie points from hardcore constituents anyway.  If the bill fails the Republicans can just blame "liberals" and "brain-washed" college graduates.  Win / win.

[Antiphon1]

This would be the time for the "adults in the room" that are supposedly still veto players in the Republican party to step up - and it seems from the article the house speaker is doing that in this case. Nuking tenure would be enormously self destructive for these states.

There aren't many adults in the room in the Texas legislature.  Or at least not many who want to be on record.  This bill is part of a number of bills targeted at education this session.  Taken as a whole the message is, "Cut funding.  Shut up liberals."  It's Texas.  What else would you expect?   Second only to Florida in the "cut off your nose to spite your face" race. 

[Wahoo Redux]

Second only to Florida in the "cut off your nose to spite your face" race.

Post-tenure review regulation for Florida university professors approved

[downer]

Although it is a complicated situation in the UK and a different political climate, tenure was abolished in the UK in 1988. There is a helpful article about it here https://mikeotsuka.medium.com/is-there-academic-tenure-in-the-uk-93aecc388616

Would the removal of tenure and the institution of post-tenure review really cause massive exodus from Texas public universities? It probably depends a great deal on how it is done.

If the crazy politicians get their way and start getting rid of people for arbitary reasons, it's easy to see how anyone who could leave would leave. But it is also possible to envisage the policy change not having a massive effect on how many faculty leave. For those who have to survive on getting grants, tenure has long been mostly irrelevant.

[Wahoo Redux]

It's hard for me to imagine any prof turning down a tenure job these days what with the market as it is----but then again, if I had a choice I would never apply to Texas or Florida.  Actually, I do have a choice and it would have to be a pretty impossibly sweet job for me to apply even given my circumstances right now.

[clean]

Frankly, I hope that they pass it! 
It would not come into effect until, if I understand things, until 2024, though there are some peculiarities with the TX contract system (dont get me started!!)

Would anyone leave? No, anyone here now would still have tenure, or be able to earn it.  Only new hires would be the issue.
Would good hires stop applying?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  Would they continue to apply, but with a desire to have a higher wage to compensate for the risk?  What would the contracts look like? Even without tenure, there would be some contractual protections (it would not be one year contracts with no notice of non renewal. (And if they WERE , THEN no one would apply anymore!) 

sometimes you have to give Admincritters and (worse) Political Hemorrhoids  (inflamed assholes) EVERYTHING that they ask for!  Let them learn the hard way about 'the other shoe' and how their policies really work in practice!   

[apl68]

My take is that they believe that "tenure" = "people who don't work for a salary, and since public institutions depend in part on tax dollars, tenured professors are basically liberal elite welfare queens." They already believe the process fails right-leaning profs -- just consider the guy from Alabama who "resigned" over politics, when in reality he was denied tenure. I think the public resentment comes from the image that tenured professors no longer work but still draw a paycheck, more than the thought that they're brainwashers. But that's just my take from talking to non-academics who support the abolishing of tenure. (FWIW, they're the same people who argue for term limits in Congress)

In all likelihood the idea that tenure leads to under-performing, overpaid academics is the main sentiment behind this.  It really is a common public perception.