Full Professor looking for new position

[ProfJohn]

Dear Colleagues,

I a full, tenured professor looking for a new position. Am I wasting my time applying for an Assistant Professor position? My inner critic tells me that doing so would be wasted effort, but I am hoping otherwise. Any thoughts?

[lightning]

AFTDJ

[Parasaurolophus]

AFTDJ

In case that wasn't clear: Apply For The Damn Job!

[fizzycist]

Actually, in my circles (R1 public), I suspect a tenured full professor is wasting their time applying for a position that is listed as assistant prof rank only. At some point it looks a little desperate or at least naive if you are just cold spamming all over. I'd at least email the search chair and find out if a higher rank is something they would consider. More likely a position listed to include Associate or open rank is a better bet.

[Sun_Worshiper]

Actually, in my circles (R1 public), I suspect a tenured full professor is wasting their time applying for a position that is listed as assistant prof rank only. At some point it looks a little desperate or at least naive if you are just cold spamming all over. I'd at least email the search chair and find out if a higher rank is something they would consider. More likely a position listed to include Associate or open rank is a better bet.

I agree with this. We would never hire a full professor as an assistant at my middling R1.

There is a famous case I know of a tenured professor (I think associate) that took an assistant position at a slightly better university. This person didn't get tenure at the new place and spent the next several years posting bitterly about it online, blasting her chair, letter writers, and colleagues. There are a couple of lessons there, but the most important one is that giving up tenure is almost always a mistake.

[spork]

Not an answer to the specific question you asked, but I will continue to beat one of my favorite dead horses:

If you are dissatisfied with your current job, or are happy with it but worried about your employer going bankrupt, you should think seriously about leaving academia altogether. The existing model of higher education in this country is no longer viable.

[AJ_Katz]

HR does not allow us to offer someone a rank that was not advertised.  When I've asked, they said that we would have gotten a different pool of candidates if we had included that as part of the advertisement, so it could be considered a discriminatory hiring practices if we were to do that. Therefore, if someone wants to give up tenure and rank, they can and we would give them credit towards time in rank.  I have had a faculty member successfully go through that process in my department, no problem there.  I've also been reminded previously that tenure and rank are two different things and need not always go hand in hand (i.e. someone is hired at associate but still has to go up for tenure later on). 

I think one of the down sides to applying for an assistant rank when you are a full professor is that your experience could count against you if there is a specific subject matter or task that the home department is hiring this person to fill or build.  Someone fresh out of a postdoc or PhD has not yet built their own program, so it lets the hiring committee envision how those skills could be use to built the program.  But for someone who has a track record already, it is clear what they would bring to the program and the scope/scale of that potential.  Certainly, I could envision scenarios where that would be an absolute dream to bring in someone with experience like that, especially in a department that is bottom heavy with assistant professors already. 

Have you considered taking dept head or chair roles?  You might have more traction there.

[clean]

1.  As above, IF the position is advertised as an Assistant Prof. position, then they will not be able to change the job.
However, that doesnt mean you should not apply.
You CAN apply and you WILL be considered (because of the same HR regs), BUT you will need to write a really targeted cover letter to explain why you would be willing to drop from the rank of Professor to Assistant Professor.  Remember, that you will not be offered tenure with this job!  You need to make a convincing argument that you are ONLY applying at that ONE place BECAUSE ....   convince them that THEY are Your Dream Job/Location

2.  Make sure that you can hit it out of the park with your application. Are you competitive with a newly minted person for an Assistant Prof position?  (Again, back to the Cover Letter---   Address each line on the and show how you exceed those qualifications.)

3. Make sure that you include every item on the ad.  (If they want recent teaching evaluations, letters of reference, a copy of a recent publication.... Whatever they want, make sure you provide it, and NOTE it in the Cover Letter that you have included it (as sometimes some lazy/overworked committee member may not have noticed/found it, so MAKE sure you note it!)

Summary:
USE the application letter to address anything in the ad, Make sure you address WHY this new place is meant for you, (and You for THEM) and why you are willing to give up rank and tenure.  Then include everything in the ad in your application materials and note in the application letter that it is included.


Good Luck!!

(So why ARE you willing to give up rank and tenure to apply for this ONE place

[Sea_Ice]

Moving from Full to Assistant and then working back to Full has been done, but it's a rare path.  I know of at least one Forumite who has accomplished it, & who perhaps will see this and decide to weigh in.

However, you've gotten lots of good advice thus far, and it's starting to hit many of the major points that you need to consider.

The only things I'll add right now are:
 1) run the numbers on your finances - how will you cope if you do get a job, and then (for whatever reason) it evaporates before tenure?;
 2) also look for non-faculty or mostly administrative jobs, in addition to non-academic jobs (just to help you gain perspective on your skills, etc.);
 3) if your place really is that bad, leaving might be the best thing you can do for everyone involved (you get the joy of getting out of there, TPTB have to live with knowing that you chose to start over elsewhere - and might even have to explain it...).

[jerseyjay]

One could argue, along the lines of Spork's post, that anybody who applies for any academic job is wasting their job, given the state of academia today.

However, that does not really answer your specific question. I think the answer is: it depends but that it may still be useful to apply. Of course, like everything, this is field specific.

The key, I think as somebody else mentioned, is to have a well-crafted cover letter that makes the case that this job is something that will really be logical and useful for your trajectory. I suppose it could be that you are moving to a better school, or the position is more aligned with your current research. There are also factors such as geography and the condition of current school (e.g., the new position is where you grew up or your current school is about to go bankrupt). I would at most mention these obliquely--you need to make a positive case for why the new job is good for you, and why you are good for it.

If, say, you are applying as a full professor at Harvard to an assistant professor at a community college in Carson City, you probably should have some good explanation. If you are a full professor at Carson City Community College applying for an assistant professorship at Harvard, this might be more understandable, but you need to make a good case that you meet the requirements of Harvard.

I think the search committee will be looking for signs that you are just trying to get an offer to increase your current salary; that there is some impending scandal you are trying to escape; that you just got bored with your current job (and may soon get bored at a new job), etc.

I don't think you could negotiate a different job than the one offered (e.g., tenure status) but I think you could try to negotiate an quicker tenure clock. However, just because you qualified for full 20 years ago at another school does not mean you would get tenure at the new school automatically. (Truth be known, at my school, there are several professors who got tenure 20 years ago who wouldn't get tenure here today.)

So AFTDJ, but with your eyes open.

[Ruralguy]

I would basically go with what Jerseyjay said, but even more so. That is, I think *any* such move needs to be *highly* justified, as if you were making a big jump in type of institution and/or geography and such. The reason I say so is that I think just about any dept. looking at such an application is going to be highly skeptical. You have to win them over, and you are starting at a deficit in your argument.

That being said, if you can do that, and are willing to start from the ground floor, them AFTDJ.

Oh, one more thing. Although some schools won't allow for negotiation in rank and may not even allow for much negotiation in salary, some will. So, until you apply and find out, anything is potentially flexible. But if you can do some research without giving yourself away, it could help with later negotiations.

[ProfJohn]

Thank you all for your helpful and pointed advice.
Let me add some more information. I am in a humanities field, and my current institution has gutted the humanities and is on track for becoming almost exclusively a professional school. The positions I am considering have very strong humanities programs and each has a very vibrant intellectual culture. In short, they are each a dream job for me. Also, my spouse and I have had a particularly bad experience for our family in our current location (nothing scandalous) and lets just say we want to "get the xxxx outta Dodge," and start over at a more open and progressive city. How might I communicate the desire to move away without sounding like I am running from something?

[spork]

"It has become evident that the financial condition of my current university is deteriorating."

[Ruralguy]

Its tricky. For any negative you mention about your current place, try to balance with something positive that makes it clear you still like your career, colleagues, etc. If none of that is true, then think about whether you want to stay in academia. Also, don't mention very many negatives about your current place! the financial statement is maybe worth mentioning, but don't get into details, and lead with a positive.

[poiuy]

Thank you all for your helpful and pointed advice.
Let me add some more information. I am in a humanities field, and my current institution has gutted the humanities and is on track for becoming almost exclusively a professional school. The positions I am considering have very strong humanities programs and each has a very vibrant intellectual culture. In short, they are each a dream job for me. Also, my spouse and I have had a particularly bad experience for our family in our current location (nothing scandalous) and lets just say we want to "get the xxxx outta Dodge," and start over at a more open and progressive city. How might I communicate the desire to move away without sounding like I am running from something?

I wish you the best in your job search.  In addition to what others have said, let me repeat a suggestion I made in another thread (relating to tenure denial).  If you have any interest in an academic adjacent career, use some of your remaining time at your current institution to gain documented experience / certifications in admin roles and if possible in the institution's IRB. You can be in any field to do these, if you are interested, organized, willing to learn, good at communications - which you are I bet.
There is a shortage of people especially in the IRB area, based on the experience of multiple higher education institutions in my area.
I wish you all the best.