NSF CAREER Grant UPDATE Thread

[aspiring.academic]

My program manager emailed me to schedule a time (next week) to discuss my early career proposal's review outcome. What does this mean? Bad news on the way?

Very good sign. They usually won't bother calling with bad news.
Just don't miss the call lol

Hmmm... that is not my experience. A phone call is often to convey information that they would prefer not to write down. The only time I have received a call from an NSF program manager regarding one of my grant proposals, it was to let me know that I had been on the borderline and he was encouraging me to re-submit with only minor changes. Of course, standard practice may vary by field, but it is not a good use of their time to call successful PIs.

I will also say that the attempts to infer when a review panel is meeting reported on this thread is amusing to me. My experience is that there is a significant time delay between panel meeting and results being announced. I have *never* heard back from the NSF within the nominal 6 month notification window for any of my grant proposals.

My experience working directly with NSF PDs in CISE has been the polar opposite of what you describe, especially when it comes to the CAREER. Most PDs know the significance of the CAREER and that they're dealing with early career researchers. PDs go out of their way to contact potential CAREER awardees, to congratulate them on their work, discuss budgetary changes, and encourage them along their path.

As researchers progress and become more senior in their fields, it's less likely they are contacted on the phone unless it's for a large award. Most academics recognize the significance of the CAREER but its funding amount is small compared to a core award. I will agree in one area in that a phone call can provide some insight that the PD may not put in an email. However, in most cases, the researcher already knows the proposal isn't funded, and the phone call comes after the posting of panel reviews to let you know you were borderline. And even if that isn't the case with the person that posted about setting up a time to call, just the mere fact that the PD is reaching out, even if it's a decline, establishes a relationship and opens communication, which is promising and encouraging for the next round.

Some PDs are more personable than others. Maybe your PDs just weren't interested or invested and didn't bother reaching out to you. Others want to build a rapport with their awardees and have a vested interest in their success and try to establish some sort of relationship with them.

Timelines for notifications vary. Some move pretty quickly after the panels, and others are a bit slower. Going back to previous years, researchers will begin to know something, depending on their areas, as soon as this month in an unofficial capacity.

@ocean2428, keep you head up! Be optimistic and know that everyone isn't getting a phone call! That alone matters.

My experience with CISE has been different. My PD never bothers calling. I had submitted a proposal to one of the "early-career" programs and the panel was split between competitive and low-competitive. Eventually, the proposal was rejected. I had a call with the PD--the PD was not able to provide any further information. He was just repeating what was already written in the reviews. Also, some of the reviews from a technical standpoint were wrong. I tried to explain politely that some of the comments were not very accurate and based on what the PD said, I understood that he just lets the reviewers talk without intervening even if he feels that the discussion might be going to the wrong direction. I guess it is what it is.

How long has the PD been a PD? The behavior you described usually falls in the realm of newer PDs. From my experience, the more tenured, the more information they provide and the more nurturing they are to potential awardees. Some have gone to great lengths to call after a decline and explain why 'X' program is a better fit for what you've already written than the program for which you submitted.

One thing I can say, you won't get far disagreeing with the panel and expressing that to the PD. I totally get what you're saying though since those CRII panels get a lot of proposals from early career folks. There's certainly a possibility that the panel wasn't as well versed in what you were proposing. I've personally had that happen before and it's not a pleasing experience. However, largely the PD is going to side with the consensus of the panel reviews. My takeaway from that instance was to scope the project a bit better and explain my perspective earlier in the proposal to better manage the panel's perceptions.

Even though I learned all of that as a fellow working in close concert with PDs, my first 3 proposals after leaving the agency were all declined. One didn't have a shot of being funded. The next two were close enough where the PDs called after posting the panel reviews. The next 3 were all funded. I can only speak to my experiences in CISE including at CISE CAREER workshops. Largely the PDs don't want to be seen as inaccessible and black holes, but they also have to uphold the integrity of the system in which they work even if some would agree that it's not the best system.

For what it's worth, my experience is in IIS and CNS.

[ocean2428]

Thank you everyone for encouraging replies. I have set up a phone call with my PD tomorrow at 9.30 AM, fingers crossed.

[ocean2428]

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

[lee2002hu]

Big congrats! It almost means (>99.99%) that your project will be funded shortly.

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

[doc700]

Congrats!!!!  After all of your drama with the DOE Early Career, I'm so excited that you seem on the verge of a big win here!!  I'll keep my fingers crossed for you that the grant comes all the way through.

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

[aspiring.academic]

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

I love to hear it!

[lightofhope]

You are so early to know the outcome.
Congratulations！

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

[stan_c]

Congratulations, ocean2428!

Could I ask how your PD knew about your recent work? For example, did you provide the PD with updates after you submitted your proposal (and if so, is that typically encouraged?)

I had the phone call with my PD. The review outcome was E/E/VG/VG-G. During the panel review, the proposal landed in the middle of the very competitive category. So the proposal eligible for funding but need to address the last referee's concern. The referee made a case that experimental methods that I am using may not work, but it seems like the referee wasn't aware of my recent work published in Nature, which we demonstrated that it does work. The good news is my PD fully aware of the recent work, so he asked me to provide a 1-page summary addressing this concern. However, he said he can't guarantee anything at this point, but he seems optimistic.

[ocean2428]

Yes, before I submitted the proposal, I did mention to him that our paper was accepted (early Aug), and later when the paper actually got published, I sent him a copy. So, he was fully aware of it but the referee may not know about the paper until it got published.

[stan_c]

Thanks! Very helpful.

[fizzycist]

Congrats ocean, exciting times!

[doc700]

Does anyone happen to know anything about the YIP?  I received an email that it was delayed until the 23rd but still haven't heard.  Presumably still delayed but anyone have insight?

Unrelated to NSF CAREER, did anyone else apply for AFOSR YIP?  Any ideas when that will be announced?

The FY21 YIP announcement will be coming on Friday, 16 Oct. Thanks to all who applied! We received over 200+ submissions. Good Luck!!!

Posted by AFOSR recently.

[lee2002hu]

Maybe the budget issue? We are still in the CR and need to see how the budget for fundamental research will be after the election...

Does anyone happen to know anything about the YIP?  I received an email that it was delayed until the 23rd but still haven't heard.  Presumably still delayed but anyone have insight?

Unrelated to NSF CAREER, did anyone else apply for AFOSR YIP?  Any ideas when that will be announced?

The FY21 YIP announcement will be coming on Friday, 16 Oct. Thanks to all who applied! We received over 200+ submissions. Good Luck!!!

Posted by AFOSR recently.

[PopeyesSandwich]

I submitted my CAREER proposal (second time) to CMMI. Status changed ("Pending" to "Pending") with a new PD on 10/29/2020. No phone call or email. Likely an ominous sign.

[aspiring.academic]

I submitted my CAREER proposal (second time) to CMMI. Status changed ("Pending" to "Pending") with a new PD on 10/29/2020. No phone call or email. Likely an ominous sign.

It means there's a PD and the status date reflects that update...nothing more, nothing less.