Topic: Bang Your Head on Your Desk - the thread of teaching despair!

[dr_evil]

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Yes, I ran into this too at my old institution. The students felt wildly entitled there. My current institution is less grade-grubby, although I did get a grade complaint just today from a student who didn't like the grade they got on their essay that was returned a month ago.

End of the term approaching? Suddenly, the students have realized they are in danger of not passing or not getting an A, which is when the grade grubbing really gets going.

The entitlement here has been growing. I've had multiple requests (different students) for "do overs" on assignments that they didn't like their grade on. They aren't arguing that the grade is wrong, but that they should get to redo it for a better grade.

[onehappyunicorn]

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Yes, I ran into this too at my old institution. The students felt wildly entitled there. My current institution is less grade-grubby, although I did get a grade complaint just today from a student who didn't like the grade they got on their essay that was returned a month ago.

End of the term approaching? Suddenly, the students have realized they are in danger of not passing or not getting an A, which is when the grade grubbing really gets going.

The entitlement here has been growing. I've had multiple requests (different students) for "do overs" on assignments that they didn't like their grade on. They aren't arguing that the grade is wrong, but that they should get to redo it for a better grade.

Just had a student send me an email with make up work attached at 5pm today. Any make-ups were due by 5pm last Friday and they needed to be submitted in Blackboard...

[the_geneticist]

My head banging moment: student who do not want to keep their graded assignments, even though they know that they have a midterm exam that is going to be very similar to the questions on their assignments.  Then they say that they "don't know what to study".  Aargh!

[apl68]

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Yes, I ran into this too at my old institution. The students felt wildly entitled there. My current institution is less grade-grubby, although I did get a grade complaint just today from a student who didn't like the grade they got on their essay that was returned a month ago.

End of the term approaching? Suddenly, the students have realized they are in danger of not passing or not getting an A, which is when the grade grubbing really gets going.

The entitlement here has been growing. I've had multiple requests (different students) for "do overs" on assignments that they didn't like their grade on. They aren't arguing that the grade is wrong, but that they should get to redo it for a better grade.

I wonder if some of this is students trying to skimp on class effort, then seeing from their grades that they skimped too much and wanting a do-over. 

[fosca]

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Yes, I ran into this too at my old institution. The students felt wildly entitled there. My current institution is less grade-grubby, although I did get a grade complaint just today from a student who didn't like the grade they got on their essay that was returned a month ago.

End of the term approaching? Suddenly, the students have realized they are in danger of not passing or not getting an A, which is when the grade grubbing really gets going.

The entitlement here has been growing. I've had multiple requests (different students) for "do overs" on assignments that they didn't like their grade on. They aren't arguing that the grade is wrong, but that they should get to redo it for a better grade.

I really think a lot of schools used "letting them do it over" during COVID; I've started to run into students who are seemingly offended that I don't let them redo assignments over for a better grade, or who just sent it to me or upload it assuming I'll grade it much more than I ever have in the past (including in this job).  I realize redoing assignments has a pedagogical value, but I've seen it abused too much ("I'll slack/plagiarize this, and if it gets through great, and if it doesn't I'll just do it over until I get a grade I like").  Plus, I teach five sections (38 students per section, at least at first) each semester of a fairly writing-intensive online course, and I simply don't have the time/energy to regrade dozens of do-overs for each assignment.  So I drop one or two of everything instead.

[marshwiggle]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

[dismalist]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

Yes, and this must be worn on one's clothing where everybody can see it!

Now, that would be incentives to work wonders!

Actually, no. The difficulty is that many, many students don't actually have to learn anything at college to succeed in life. They just have to have been there. And they know it. Their behavior shows that they know it.

[kaysixteen]

Sure, some of them are trying to game the system, but educators, whether k12 or higher ed, are probaby fooling themselves/ engaging in wishful thinking, when/if they assume that covid is all over, AND that the students, who of course had to go through the pandemic, should be just 'back to normal', with no ongoing educational, social, and psychological aftereffects or outright deficits (though, of course, not all of them will have such).   We will have to make hard choices, and direct resources to ameliorating problems we are just not used to having to deal with.

[AvidReader]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

Actually, I have done a version of this, where I made assignments worth about 1030 points over the semester, then graded each assignment out of its total point value. At 600 points (well, 595), I tell a student he or she is passing. At 700, the student has "locked in" a C. One only needs to hit 900 points for an "A," but the extra 30 points above 1000 function as drop grades.

I have done it in graduate classes out of 100 points; once the students understand why the grade on the essay is in the teens (because it's out of 20 points) it works pretty well.

AR.

[marshwiggle]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

Actually, I have done a version of this, where I made assignments worth about 1030 points over the semester, then graded each assignment out of its total point value. At 600 points (well, 595), I tell a student he or she is passing. At 700, the student has "locked in" a C. One only needs to hit 900 points for an "A," but the extra 30 points above 1000 function as drop grades.

I have done it in graduate classes out of 100 points; once the students understand why the grade on the essay is in the teens (because it's out of 20 points) it works pretty well.

AR.

I use cumulative grades as well, and I think they should be the norm. "This is what you would get on the course if you didn't do anything more after today." The only tricky part is making it clear how much runway they have left; i.e. "This is the highest grade you could get if you aced everything from this point on."

[evil_physics_witchcraft]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

Actually, I have done a version of this, where I made assignments worth about 1030 points over the semester, then graded each assignment out of its total point value. At 600 points (well, 595), I tell a student he or she is passing. At 700, the student has "locked in" a C. One only needs to hit 900 points for an "A," but the extra 30 points above 1000 function as drop grades.

I have done it in graduate classes out of 100 points; once the students understand why the grade on the essay is in the teens (because it's out of 20 points) it works pretty well.

AR.

I also use a point system similar to this. I thought it would make sense to students, but alas, some of them just do not get it. Maybe I could color code it? Some students seem to like anything but numbers.

[Caracal]

Maybe what we need is a mastery-based system where every student gets a "grade thermometer" like they use in fundraising campaigns, that shows YOUR CURRENT GRADE. As they hand in more stuff, the mercury rises until they get the grade they want and they can cash out. (They'd probably be amazed at how little some things move the scale.)

Actually, I have done a version of this, where I made assignments worth about 1030 points over the semester, then graded each assignment out of its total point value. At 600 points (well, 595), I tell a student he or she is passing. At 700, the student has "locked in" a C. One only needs to hit 900 points for an "A," but the extra 30 points above 1000 function as drop grades.

I have done it in graduate classes out of 100 points; once the students understand why the grade on the essay is in the teens (because it's out of 20 points) it works pretty well.

AR.

I also use a point system similar to this. I thought it would make sense to students, but alas, some of them just do not get it. Maybe I could color code it? Some students seem to like anything but numbers.

Yeah, I like the idea. I hate the "I was getting an A, but now I'm not" emails. However, students at my school have really come to expect to see their grade in that format, and I suspect I would be deluged with emails from students alarmed that their grade says they are failing the course and complaining about how unclear I am. If it was the norm, I think it would work, but it isn't worth it for me to try to go against the grain...

[the_geneticist]

I had to turn OFF the "display grade in percent" feature since students would freak out that their A+ was now a B- after they turned in their second assignment.  Uh, you had an A+ on the 5 point, open-note, highest of 2 attempts, syllabus quiz.  You now have 18 of 20 possible points.  There are over 400 in the course.  Calm down.

I'm getting to the end of the term and it's time for the "magical thinking math" to begin!  I honestly prefer when I can tell a student that it is not mathematically possible to pass compared to "it's technically, mathematically possible, but given that you earned a failing grade on the other exams, there is no way you'll earn 100% on the final".  We are allowing very late drops with no penalty.  I have never had to adjust my point cutoffs since there are a LOT of formative assessments built in (aka easy points to earn). 

[ergative]

I am somehow the best expert on how to use our CMS for online exams. The fellow who's in charge of all the details told our admin team the wrong thing, and so the exam opened this morning and students weren't able to submit their answers and were freaking out.

'We need to change [setting],' said I.
'Oh, no!' said Admin person. '[Fellow in charge] said that we shouldn't change [setting] because [bad thing].'
'But look,' I said. 'I changed the setting, and now students who are having difficulties are no longer having difficulties and [bad thing] has not happened. Furthermore, here is [other setting] that is responsible for [bad thing]. See how [other setting] is different from [setting]?'
'Oh, you are such a whizz at this!' said Admin person. 'Will you please double check all these other classes that are not your responsibility to confirm that their settings are correct?'

THIS IS NOT MY JOB! THIS IS YOUR JOB!  And yet, somehow, I am always cleaning up your mess. Every semester, somehow, there's something wrong with the exam settings on the CMS, and it's on me to clean it up. I'm so freaking sick of it.

I'm sick of telling our admin team how to do their jobs. I recognize it's my responsibility to make sure they're doing their job effectively when it comes to my class, but whenever I do that it just bleeds into checking their work for other classes that are not mine. *BANG* *BANG* *BANG* *BANG*

[OneMoreYear]

BANG!
Dear IT department, Yes, I do think there is actually something wrong with the LMS if I attempt to access the online meeting system embedded in my LMS course page, and it logs me in as a different faculty member.  I used my login to access the classroom computer and my login to access the LMS. There should be no reason the system thinks I am someone else. I then had access to all of that faculty member's recordings and their upcoming meeting list and who knows what else. Why would there even be a way in the system for this to occur?!  I don't care if you think this is user error, you need to fix this!

BANG BANG!
Dear grad student, I cannot believe that you are in the process of defending your dissertation and you still do not know how to cite a chapter in a book. Yes, we are an article field, but this cannot be the first time in 4 years that you have cited a chapter. Even if it is, you are a doctoral student! Open up the publication manual and figure it out!