Topic: Bang Your Head on Your Desk - the thread of teaching despair!

[the_geneticist]

I just had the happy event of failing a student for writing an essay with AI. I spotted the cheating immediately and he admitted it, but gave me a lot of guff about "How can I learn from this experience if I am not given any grace? Hasn't everyone made a mistake? Even you?" Despite all these smarmy pleas, I sent the incident through the Student Affairs channels and just got the okay to levy the penalty specified in my course materials. The penalty is that the student fails the entire class — as I warned them multiple times. But some kids always assume that doesn't apply to them. Well, it has now applied to this one. (And the essay AI wrote was not even in the ballpark as far as correctness went, even apart from the cheating aspect.)

I have now had at least one student trying to use AI every semester, and I have been permission to fail every one, which I have done (as I warn subsequent students! But again, they never think it will apply to them.)

Using the wrong citation format is a mistake.  Actively choosing to use AI and then turning it in - they were "mistaken" in thinking they wouldn't get caught or that the penalty wouldn't apply.

I think stu will in fact learn a lot from this "mistake"!
I do hope that they can repeat the class with someone else.

[spork]

I just had the happy event of failing a student for writing an essay with AI. I spotted the cheating immediately and he admitted it, but gave me a lot of guff about "How can I learn from this experience if I am not given any grace? Hasn't everyone made a mistake? Even you?" Despite all these smarmy pleas, I sent the incident through the Student Affairs channels and just got the okay to levy the penalty specified in my course materials. The penalty is that the student fails the entire class — as I warned them multiple times. But some kids always assume that doesn't apply to them. Well, it has now applied to this one. (And the essay AI wrote was not even in the ballpark as far as correctness went, even apart from the cheating aspect.)

I have now had at least one student trying to use AI every semester, and I have been permission to fail every one, which I have done (as I warn subsequent students! But again, they never think it will apply to them.)

Tomorrow I meet with a student about his unacknowledged AI usage in multiple assignments. Given the obvious signs of AI, I rescored those assignments as zeroes. While it is still technically possible for him to pass with a D if he does well on remaining assignments, he's getting a course grade of F for cheating.

The meeting will be on Zoom and I'm recording it. The recording will be part of the evidence that I send to our academic integrity board.

[apl68]

I just had the happy event of failing a student for writing an essay with AI. I spotted the cheating immediately and he admitted it, but gave me a lot of guff about "How can I learn from this experience if I am not given any grace? Hasn't everyone made a mistake? Even you?" Despite all these smarmy pleas, I sent the incident through the Student Affairs channels and just got the okay to levy the penalty specified in my course materials. The penalty is that the student fails the entire class — as I warned them multiple times. But some kids always assume that doesn't apply to them. Well, it has now applied to this one. (And the essay AI wrote was not even in the ballpark as far as correctness went, even apart from the cheating aspect.)

I have now had at least one student trying to use AI every semester, and I have been permission to fail every one, which I have done (as I warn subsequent students! But again, they never think it will apply to them.)

Using the wrong citation format is a mistake.  Actively choosing to use AI and then turning it in - they were "mistaken" in thinking they wouldn't get caught or that the penalty wouldn't apply.

I think stu will in fact learn a lot from this "mistake"!
I do hope that they can repeat the class with someone else.

Also "grace" is something we're grateful for receiving because we know we didn't earn it, not something we feel others are obligated to give us.

Yes, this ought to be an educational experience in its own way.  Maybe if they can get this lesson out of the way, they can start learning the ones they originally came to school to learn.  Like how to write your own assignment, instead of having a machine do it for you.  After all, if the only thing you know how to do is tell a machine to do stuff for you, why would anybody ever need to hire you?

[ciao_yall]

On the subject of AI, there is an

After all, if the only thing you know how to do is tell a machine to do stuff for you, why would anybody ever need to hire you?

The New Yorker has an interesting article this week on using AI for tasks that require manual dexterity. It's  lot harder than it sounds.

The author makes the point that human tasks will remain those that require our hands - plumbing, cooking, dependent care.

Someone's gotta clean the robots.

[bio-nonymous]

On the subject of AI, there is an

After all, if the only thing you know how to do is tell a machine to do stuff for you, why would anybody ever need to hire you?

The New Yorker has an interesting article this week on using AI for tasks that require manual dexterity. It's  lot harder than it sounds.

The author makes the point that human tasks will remain those that require our hands - plumbing, cooking, dependent care.

Someone's gotta clean the robots.

I 100% agree. I have often thought also about how would AI or a robot handle jobs that aren't black/white (0/1) such as being a carpenter--i.e., at just what angle should I hit the nail head and with how much force applied to get this nail to go in the proper direction to join this 2x4 to this joist? LOTS of wishy washy "art not science" decisions make up this type of task along with complicated muscle memory stuff that I think would be very tough for a robot to parse. This is just one example, of course, and there are probably many thousands of others. It may be a long time before a robot can handle things like that.  BUT when AIs can program other AIs, program other robots to build new robots, and if/when AIs become self-aware, then we may have a SKYNET alert. I think that type of singularity is approaching rapidly. I don't want to be a slave to the machines...

[the_geneticist]

There is a reason we've been successful making tools and machines for humans to use to make tasks faster (dishwashers, nail guns, drive-through car washes), but can't outsource the task to a robot.  I suppose you could argue that the carwash is a giant robot, but you still need humans to be there to handle the money and maintenance.  And a "hand detail" car wash both is higher quality and costs more because humans are better at complicated tasks compared to the generic settings in the automated carwash.
Humans are better "jack of all trades" and "specialists for creative tasks".  Just because the robot carwash has soapy water, doesn't mean it can scrub your floors.

[mythbuster]

Student emails me before class asking if I can bring the exams with me as she did not pick hers up last time.

I forget but make an announcement that after class (the last one of the semester) to just follow me back to my office to pick up exams , which is all of down the hall. Several other students do just that.

Same Student emails me 20 minutes into said class to make an appointment for the next day. She was NOT one that picked up their exam after class. I wonder why not since she SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN CLASS!

[sinenomine]

Yesterday my freshman writing class students started their oral presentations of their final papers. Not a single one knew their password to log in to access their slides and material. I've had semesters where one or two couldn't log in, but never all of them. And yes, I reminded them to have passwords handy, and they've known about the assignment since September.

The other half of the class will do their presentations on Monday. I'll be interested to see if they learned from their classmates' screw ups.

[Liquidambar]

Yesterday my freshman writing class students started their oral presentations of their final papers. Not a single one knew their password to log in to access their slides and material. I've had semesters where one or two couldn't log in, but never all of them. And yes, I reminded them to have passwords handy, and they've known about the assignment since September.

The other half of the class will do their presentations on Monday. I'll be interested to see if they learned from their classmates' screw ups.

This is one reason I require my students to make their slides publicly viewable and give me the link in advance.  I have a master list of their links so I can queue up all their slides.  I hope your Monday students do better!

[the_geneticist]

My students are also giving presentations.  I make the pre-lab assignment for that day sending a link to their slides.  It's a win-win.  They students know they have to finish before the start* of class, it's easy to queue up their slides, and they get points for being responsible.

*I wish I was joking when I say that some are hopeful they can quickly finish while other teams are actively presenting.  My rule is they have to put their devices away and be attentive audience members and they have to ask questions.  Some act like it's pure agony to be away from their phone for that long.

[spork]

I just had the happy event of failing a student for writing an essay with AI. I spotted the cheating immediately and he admitted it
[...]

Tomorrow I meet with a student about his unacknowledged AI usage in multiple assignments.

[...]

My conversation with the student:

"I wanted to meet with you because it looks like you used AI for many of your assignments."

"Yes, I did."

"You used AI to complete these assignments?"

"Yes."

No wailing, no gnashing of teeth. I said per the policy in the syllabus, he would be getting an F for cheating. His only question for me was "Will the F be counted in my GPA?" Here is the kicker: he said he's taking the course pass/fail. He could have easily passed if he hadn't used AI. Idiot.

[the_geneticist]

My weakest TA is thankfully graduating.

We were talking about scoring student presentations & the rest of the TAs were sharing common errors or omissions "students forgot to include [thing]".

TA "Wait, they needed to include [thing]?"

me "Yes. I need you to go back and rescore"

TA "But I've already put in the grades!"

Me "You're going to have to update those"

TA "Aww, man.  I thought I was done"

[fishbrains]

I'm having a minor resurgence in students asking me, in various flavors, "When's the last day you can submit final grades into the system?"

My response of, "The last day to submit any work is listed on the syllabus. I won't accept work after that," just seems to wash off of them.

So they repeat their question. Then I repeat my answer. Then I get an eye roll.

Just a few students, but enough to be kind of irritating.

[Parasaurolophus]

One of my students just told me they couldn't find anything in the library about Pearl Harbor. I think they didn't look very hard.

Or they were looking for Perl Harbir.

[evil_physics_witchcraft]

One of my online students, who has not logged into the course in over a month, just sent me an email. Apparently stu wants to make up missed work, if possible, and stu's reason for not completing the work is depression over the U.S. election results. Yes, most of us are disappointed, but I really can't accept that excuse.